View Full Version : Any one else reckon enough is enough?
Some of you may be aware that I am a keen amateur photographer and have always enjoyed the vistas that the county has to offer but alas they are vanishing fast.
I went out earlier in the week to try and catch some autumn colour which is enhanced by the low angle of the light.
Broubster lake and forrestry area has always been good just don't point the camera north, the same applies at the southern end of Loch Calder, the view down the entire length is now despoiled by the large wind turbines at Baillie.
The rolling hills above Forss, an area once frequented by Whoopers and geese in great numbers at this time of year and the haunt of roe deer are now eirily bare suffering from the same development.
I dread going along the Camster road, if used to be a wild, austere, moody landscape but no more.
Whilst I know that there are many that do not see the county as a place of great beauty, in my eyes it always has been and I am wondering how much more of the landscape will be defiled before we sink under the weight of the concrete towers and their turbines and every tourist votes with their feet?
outsidethebox
27-Oct-12, 21:54
I've never yet seen anywhere spoiled by wind turbines. They add drama to any landscape. They change static unchanging vistas to truly dynamic stages. Bring 'em on, the more the merrier.
Mystical Potato Head
27-Oct-12, 22:59
I've never yet seen anywhere spoiled by wind turbines. They add drama to any landscape. They change static unchanging vistas to truly dynamic stages. Bring 'em on, the more the merrier.
These static unchanging vistas are obviously ones you have never bothered to look at or you would have noticed they change whenever the weather changes.They already have drama when the sun sets or rises,when a band of rain blows across the landscape,when rays of sunlight shine through the clouds casting dappled light on so called unchanging vistas.Whenever the light changes so does the view.
Tilly Teckel
27-Oct-12, 23:46
I have to agree with Lizz that the drive down the Camster road is not as enjoyable at the moment owing to the works in operation. However, I also agree strongly with outsidethebox; I believe wind farms can add to the drama of a landscape. I find the contrast between the wild natural landscape and the 'maxi/minimalism' (new term coined there!) of the turbines strikingly attractive.
I also have to say I have not witnessed the same dearth of wildlife mentioned by Lizz in wind farm areas. In fact, I love deer spotting and there is one wind farm I visit regularly because I know I am guaranteed to see both Roe and Red. I'm sure that during construction the wildlife are disturbed but they certainly have no qualms about living amongst the turbines once they are in situ, at least from my experience.
Lizz, the big problem is if not wind turbines what else, nuclear? Nuclear, spoils the countryside for hundreds of thousands of years if not for ever in reality. Long after we are all dead, generations will have to deal with the leftover waste.
'The rolling hills above Forss, an area once frequented by Whoopers and geese in great numbers at this time of year and the haunt of roe deer are now eirily bare suffering from the same development'.
Right now there are the greatest numbers of geese I have ever seen in the Forss area at this time of year. There are also more roe deer now than there has ever been.
It is also true that there are also more wind turbines in the area than there has ever been. Could it be the windfarms are actually attracting wildlife to the area?
Tugmistress
28-Oct-12, 15:38
I think there are people out there that don't see things the way people who photograph do, ............ a good example is last week(?) on evening shift the sun is going down and the ship is coming in, the white is showing as slightly golden and i try to tell him about the 'golden hour' and the changing light, yet all he could see was the ship as white and blue, he couldn't grasp the subtle changes in the hue :)
I am not saying everyone will fall in to that category but i reckon quite a few will in what they see on the landscape.
jaykay, have n't seen a single goose or swan on or around the lower reaches of Forss river so far this winter, used to regularly see them round Skaill and Roe Deer, notice that the woodland further up has also been badly disturbed and the finches that used to be there in their hundreds seem to have moved on.
gerry4, if generating electricity from the wind was not heavily subsidised I wonder just how many of these turbines there would be, but that's another arguement and one that I am not proposing to discus on this thread.
My point was that where there were panoramas, stunning views, coastline to kill for much of this has spoilt with the intrusive nature of some of the wind farms.
I photograph too, still life, some urban landscape, but particularly rural landscape. From a photographer's point of view more and more land is being blighted by these hideous windmills. Too much unspoiled land is being industrialised. One of the first things I check now before booking a weekend away with my cameras is whether the area has windfarms, if it does I look elsewhere. Another thing that ruins a good landscape are aircraft vapour trails. Wn Eyjafjallajökull erupted in 2010 we had a lovely couple of weeks with no vapour trails to ruin the sky.
I photograph too, still life, some urban landscape, but particularly rural landscape. From a photographer's point of view more and more land is being blighted by these hideous windmills. Too much unspoiled land is being industrialised. One of the first things I check now before booking a weekend away with my cameras is whether the area has windfarms, if it does I look elsewhere. Another thing that ruins a good landscape are aircraft vapour trails. Wn Eyjafjallajökull erupted in 2010 we had a lovely couple of weeks with no vapour trails to ruin the sky.
We could always go back to the pre industrialised state. Hang on though, there would be no cameras. Also I presume you never fly.
The countryside is not a static thing, it changes. The Highlands we know was created by the victorians for shooting. It also changed with the highland clearances & the introduction of sheep.
We could always go back to the pre industrialised state. Hang on though, there would be no cameras. Also I presume you never fly.
The countryside is not a static thing, it changes. The Highlands we know was created by the victorians for shooting. It also changed with the highland clearances & the introduction of sheep.
My point is if I want to photograph an industrial landscape I can go to a city or industrial region. Too much unspoiled countryside is being ruined and lost to these vile windmills. And yes, I don't fly.
You don't need industry to make photographs. Anyone can make and use a pinhole camera and it isn't too difficult to make and use light sensitised paper to make a photograph.
I was just trying to make the point that landscapes changes from era to era. People said that railways, telegraph pole, electricity pylons, etc have spoilt the countryside in previous eras. Now it is turbines, in the future goodness knows what it will be.
The landscape cannot be kept in a bubble, immuned from outside influences. The worlds & this country's population keeps on increasing and more resources have to be utilised. Some for the better some for the worse.
Would it not be more sensible to address the real issue - population growth - rather than destroy more and more of the natural world? The world is finite, we cannot keep growing.
That was tried in China and failed. I do agree that the world is finite, that is why I am all in favour of renewable energy. This therefore must include turbines currently. It also means countries like ours should waste less food, grow more of our own & not plunder the resources of poor countries.
It should also include putting strong controls on the Futures market who make vast money out of food & oil shortages, prices essential commodities & food out of the reach of poorer countries.
achingale
28-Oct-12, 19:50
I think it is time Caithness was looked at as a county and not as one massive wind generating farm. They are a blot on the landscape but I also understand the need for alternative power, so why not go solar so our hertiage is as our ancestors saw it?
outsidethebox
28-Oct-12, 20:33
I think it is time Caithness was looked at as a county and not as one massive wind generating farm. They are a blot on the landscape but I also understand the need for alternative power, so why not go solar so our hertiage is as our ancestors saw it?
Oh yes, why not, solar would not cause a blot on the landscape:
http://ww1.prweb.com/prfiles/2009/01/29/378024/nrSolarPanelSolarInstallationPHB.jpg
It does seem silly to fill a field with solar panels when there are so many empty roofs nearby...
It does seem silly to fill a field with solar panels when there are so many empty roofs nearby...
Economics... It's cheaper...
outsidethebox
28-Oct-12, 21:19
It does seem silly to fill a field with solar panels when there are so many empty roofs nearby...not all of those roofs face the right direction, and to produce sufficient electricity here in our northern latitudes take a lot of PV cells
Invisible
30-Oct-12, 15:51
"Drama of a landscape". I like that phrase. Drive up Camster road and see the towering yellow crane, now thats dramatic.
However think of all the workers who come from all different part of this country and of course other countries, who spend weeks up here away from their families and homes to construct and provide us with these turbines. Think of their feelings or opinions of us when they hear that the locals are unhappy at what they do.............Think how the negative attitude of the locals could be spoiling the county.....word of mouth has great influence.
Even Chance
30-Oct-12, 17:03
"Drama of a landscape". I like that phrase. Drive up Camster road and see the towering yellow crane, now thats dramatic.
However think of all the workers who come from all different part of this country and of course other countries, who spend weeks up here away from their families and homes to construct and provide us with these turbines. Think of their feelings or opinions of us when they hear that the locals are unhappy at what they do.............Think how the negative attitude of the locals could be spoiling the county.....word of mouth has great influence.
I actually know turbine workers that have been both verbally AND physically attacked in the past in Caithness. Doesnt paint a very nice mental picture of here now does it?
I dont have any issue with them at all. The countryside changes continually, as folk have said before. Are fences a blot on the landscape? Telegraph poles? Bungalows? Roads? We've made them all, and we've made the landscape what it is today.
Caithness is a beautiful landscape, and the addition of turbines doesnt change that at all. They are (in my opinion) a nice addition to an ever changing vista......
I'm assuming you're aware that the landscape you find so beautiful is itself the result of many developments over the years since probably people first settled here. Deforestation, the removal of marshes and bogs and land flatening to name but a few.
I'm assuming you're aware that the landscape you find so beautiful is itself the result of many developments over the years since probably people first settled here. Deforestation, the removal of marshes and bogs and land flatening to name but a few.
That's managing the landscape. Covering an unspoiled landscape in hundreds of square kilometres of pig ugly turbines - which are almost entirely useless because we still need conventional power plants as backup - is an entirely different thing.
neilsermk1
01-Nov-12, 13:34
However think of all the workers who come from all different part of this country and of course other countries, who spend weeks up here away from their families and homes to construct and provide us with these turbines. Think of their feelings or opinions of us when they hear that the locals are unhappy.
Yep Invisible,
I thought about it, took me all of 15 milli seconds. You can take this to the bank, I dont care about the feelings of the workers who are constructing these abominations.
We in Caithness have our fair share.
Totally agree with you Lizz. Just out of interest did you object to all of these windfarm applications when they were being applied for?
However think of all the workers who come from all different part of this country and of course other countries, who spend weeks up here away from their families and homes to construct and provide us with these turbines. Think of their feelings or opinions of us when they hear that the locals are unhappy.
Yep Invisible,
I thought about it, took me all of 15 milli seconds. You can take this to the bank, I dont care about the feelings of the workers who are constructing these abominations.
We in Caithness have our fair share.
Couldnt agree more.
rupert, unfortunately I was not a resident of the county when many of the planning applications went forward, have however lodged my serious concerns over The Lime Kiln application on biodiversity and ornithological grounds.
Oh and did any 1 notice that we have a follower at Westminster who used my quote "Enough is enough?"
have however lodged my serious concerns over The Lime Kiln application on biodiversity and ornithological grounds.
I also expressed concerns over the same issue and I subsequently received a satisfactory information sheet in the post that alleviated my fears.
Hi all, interesting thread...
I agree with Lizz that our countryside is being spoiled by all these wind farms. There is something to be said for places to remain "wild" for everyone's well-being. There is a reason why people go on holiday to see landscapes that bear no obvious signs of civilization. These are places to d-stress and leave the rat race behind, and some of us are lucky enough to be able to live there and are maybe (and understandable) a bit more apprehensive towards these developments.
Having said that, I also understand that we need alternatives to our energy needs and that wind is currently one of the options to provide these. However, everything in moderation I was always taught!
Whilst wind energy might provide us with relatively clean energy, I believe we're going the wrong way around the whole issue. Instead of trying to built enough wind farms to meet our demands we should maybe instead decrease our demands in the first place, and then maybe we wouldn't need that many turbines.
I know for a fact it is possible to use less than one third of the electricity the average household uses without having to sacrifice any modern conveniences. We're doing it every day!
I confess though that it is easy for us to to this, simply because we're forced to (we live off grid with a small turbine as our sole supply). We're not missing out on anything though. We also have all the modern commodities such as television, computer, stereo,..., but all our appliances are as energy efficient as possible. The only difference is this...
If there is no wind for a couple of days, we just need to think more about what we do, and if that means not watching television for a while, or we have to wait a while before being able to run a washing machine then so be it.
It also means that you learn to appreciate what you have and don't take anything for granted, which is probably a good thing for most of us. So maybe we should all be "forced" to use less, as it is maybe the only way to make most of us change our ways?
Sorry if this all sounds a bit moralizing, which is not my intention. Although we feel we are doing quite well on this aspect of life, we too have lots to improve on and are equally guilty of helping to destroy our planet by doing stupid things which we don't really think about.
Anyway, stuff to think about...
Yes I agree buzzard, using less energy will require us to have less wind turbines.
The trouble that we are up against is that the power companies do not want us to use less energy and what's more, most folk are not interested in using less energy for a variety of reasons.
I actually know turbine workers that have been both verbally AND physically attacked in the past in Caithness. Doesnt paint a very nice mental picture of here now does it?
I dont have any issue with them at all. The countryside changes continually, as folk have said before. Are fences a blot on the landscape? Telegraph poles? Bungalows? Roads? We've made them all, and we've made the landscape what it is today.
Caithness is a beautiful landscape, and the addition of turbines doesnt change that at all. They are (in my opinion) a nice addition to an ever changing vista......
Yes man and sheep have made the landscape what it is today, rural, just as it has always been.
Wind turbines are not, however, rural, they are industrial, they are power stations. Once you get past a certain point Caithness will cease to be rural and become industrial.
There is nothing wrong with a large wind farm like the one at Spittal, one or two industrial area in Caithness will not change the nature of the entire county but by spreading the turbines about a few here and an odd one there so that there is nowhere you can look without seeing a power station you change the nature of the entire county from rural to industrial.
Rheghead the reply I got made me even more concerned, there were questions that could not be answered at the presentation and when I asked for specifics on the matter to date none have been forthcoming although I was sent a further form so that I could expand on my misgivings.
Oh and another point, it was recently suggested that a large wind turbine installation is put next to Westminster and also Holyrood, if the windows of both institutions are then opened there will be enough hot air causing sufficient currents to power most of these islands!
ywindythesecond
08-Nov-12, 22:49
Hi Lizz.
I have been away for a while but I have been following your thread with interest. It seems that the appearance of turbines at Camster and Baillie has generated a small degree of concern over what is happening to Caithness, but the reality is that the time to call enough was about five years ago.
I will quote from memory, I am jetlagged and do not have the energy to check the numbers. If I get it wrong no doubt someone will correct me.
Large turbines
Still to be built in Caithness but with Planning permission include:
About 10 at Burn of Whilk (aka Yarrows Archaeological Trail)
About 12 at Stroupster (aka View south from the road above John o Groats)
14 at Wathegar (aka the Bilbster to Achairn extension)
3 at Thrumster
3 at Causeymire
Lurking in the background:
Halsary 18
Spittal 30 (refused at appeal but still listed by Highland Council)
Scoping (In the process but not formally applied for)
Well over 100 more.
Small turbines
I have lost count, but look around and you will see the tip of the iceberg (except you only see one fifth of an iceberg and there is a much bigger proportion of small turbines as yet invisible but coming)
The most reliable source of information is the CWIF website under windfarm sites. www.caithnesswindfarms.co.uk (http://www.caithnesswindfarms.co.uk)
Very interesting windy and welcome back.
Had ro do a run down to Inverness yesterday and am horrified that Sutherland too is under attack, spotted blades where none were visible in the past and at least 2 construction sites.
I am waiting for some one to apply for 100 at Forsinard!
ywindythesecond
09-Nov-12, 00:55
Very interesting windy and welcome back.
Had ro do a run down to Inverness yesterday and am horrified that Sutherland too is under attack, spotted blades where none were visible in the past and at least 2 construction sites.
I am waiting for some one to apply for 100 at Forsinard!
Not quite Forsinard Lizz, but no need to wait.
Consented.
Strathy North - 33 Turbines
Applied for.
Strathy South - 77 Turbines
Scoping.
Strathy Wood - 28 Turbines ( This cosily named proposal joins the dots between Strathy South and North)
It is interesting that Strathy N and S depend on Strathy South to get a grid connection across the Flow Country at Forsinard.
Check on www.caithnesswindfarms.co.uk (http://www.caithnesswindfarms.co.uk) .
Very interesting windy and welcome back.
Had ro do a run down to Inverness yesterday and am horrified that Sutherland too is under attack, spotted blades where none were visible in the past and at least 2 construction sites.
I am waiting for some one to apply for 100 at Forsinard!
I'm afraid to say that wind turbines are needed, I wish that wasn't true but they have to go somewhere. The Tory energy minister Owen recognised this fact in a recent report which chimed against his previous personal antiwind and climate denial sentiments but he has ruled them out going in less windy areas which is basically the whole of England south of a line from Bristol to Bridlington. Where do you want them? Out in the country or nearer to houses?
changilass
09-Nov-12, 10:21
I'm not totally against them, but I do wish there was some sort of rule about them being grouped together instead of spread all over the place.
newweecroft
09-Nov-12, 10:22
I have only read the OP and me answer is NO! You and your generation and the few before you have raped our planet and the new generation of adults ie internet natives hate you for your ignorance and arrogance. Wind turbines are temporary structures that provide lifesaving power in a manner that benefits the planet, as such for the thirty to fifty years we should cover areas that can handle a volume of turbines with them and balance our planet whilst we develop an alternative to fossil fuels. So yes you left the planet in a state so now you loose your view.
newweecroft
09-Nov-12, 10:29
Wind turbines are not the future of energy production they are a bandaid to get us through this technological adolescence.Chaniglas, you cant put the turbines in groups as then the council demands an EIA which costs as much as a small house to have done by consultants wanting 500 an hour.
newweecroft
09-Nov-12, 10:37
Windy,How old are you? Ballpark, 50-65, yes?Secondly, no turbines in Scotland, ok, alternative solution please? (that doesn't involve creating and then burying dangerous material with a half life of a millennia)(also based on a technology that uses materials that can be 99% recycled at the end of their useful life for at least a modicum of profit to ensure the recycling actually gets done)
Instead of trying to built enough wind farms to meet our demands we should maybe instead decrease our demands in the first place, and then maybe we wouldn't need that many turbines.Quite. But this seems to get ignored and written off by those pushing the renewables, because they too want to sell you their 'green' leccy.
I've been banging on about this, and worked on some programs in the past, to reduce consumption. But many people can't see the turbines for the windymills. Starting in the home by switching things off and unplugging things would be a massive start. Then go outside and switch lights off we don't need, then switch of heating we don't need and stop lighting buildings up at night just for the sake of it. And thats just for starters.
There is nothing wrong with a large wind farm like the one at Spittal, one or two industrial area in Caithness will not change the nature of the entire county but by spreading the turbines about a few here and an odd one there so that there is nowhere you can look without seeing a power station you change the nature of the entire county from rural to industrial.I quite agree, its the current (no pun intended) saturation that is the issue. We need to protect parts of the landscape, not for an individuals view out of the window but so that there will be areas that are unspoilt and left to more natural changes in a more organic manner.
You and your generation and the few before you have raped our planet and the new generation of adults ie internet natives hate you for your ignorance and arrogance.One cap fits all then.
Wind turbines are temporary structures.......But we are still sending in masses of oil spewing, smoke belching hydrocarbon burning machinery into delicate landscapes to then chew them up, dump thousands on tonnes of concrete into the ground. Build miles of tarmac roads, rip through swathes of the countryside to bury cables and infrastructure.
And when do they stop, once there is no more space for windymills? And how are these going to be replaced in 20 - 30 years? Has that been built into the cost or are we going to see a further hike (on top of what will be way above average increases) to replace the turbines??
Once the corporates & landowners have made their money from taxing us and destroying some amazing areas of beauty, animal habitats and landscape who is going to put it 'back' to normal? And at what / who's cost?
Or will the result be looking like this:
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5024/5857880142_bd76a15422.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ysnp/5857880142/)
Old Abandoned Wind Turbines (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ysnp/5857880142/) by Jonmikel & Kat-YSNP (http://www.flickr.com/people/ysnp/), on Flickr
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ysnp/5857880142/
John Little
09-Nov-12, 11:17
I'm afraid to say that wind turbines are needed, I wish that wasn't true but they have to go somewhere. The Tory energy minister Owen recognised this fact in a recent report which chimed against his previous personal antiwind and climate denial sentiments but he has ruled them out going in less windy areas which is basically the whole of England south of a line from Bristol to Bridlington. Where do you want them? Out in the country or nearer to houses?
Careful Reggie - you will reinstate that old myth that the windfarms are being put in Scotland because the English do not want them in the south. There's quite a few that already are south of that line - and in the west.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_onshore_wind_farms_in_the_United_Kingdom
Alec's logic - if you put enough windmills in Scotland, and aim them to catch the prevailing SW wind, eventually the sheer power of the wind on the blades will sever Scotland from the remainder of the UK. Voila! Instant Independence, in the real sense of the word!
I have only read the OP and me answer is NO! You and your generation and the few before you have raped our planet and the new generation of adults ie internet natives hate you for your ignorance and arrogance. Wind turbines are temporary structures that provide lifesaving power in a manner that benefits the planet, as such for the thirty to fifty years we should cover areas that can handle a volume of turbines with them and balance our planet whilst we develop an alternative to fossil fuels. So yes you left the planet in a state so now you loose your view.
Yes, I've seen your new generation of adults leaving burnt rubber on Poundstretcher car park, young adults couldn't afford cars when I were a lad. I've seen them doing the school run in 4X4s too, we walked to school. I've seen them in Tesco car park, we walked to the corner shop. Unlike the young adults of today we didn't have central heating, we could only heat one room, took a hot water bottle to bed, woke up with frost on the windows. Didn't have no tumble driers, clothes were hung out on the line to dry. No taking a shower twice a day, bath night was once a week and you shared the water.
And you try and tell the young people of today that ..... they won't believe you!
ywindythesecond
10-Nov-12, 00:00
Windy,How old are you? Ballpark, 50-65, yes?Secondly, no turbines in Scotland, ok, alternative solution please? (that doesn't involve creating and then burying dangerous material with a half life of a millennia)(also based on a technology that uses materials that can be 99% recycled at the end of their useful life for at least a modicum of profit to ensure the recycling actually gets done)
66 coming up 67. I didn't say "no turbines in Scotland". If I were to say anything like that I would have said no turbines anywhere unless they were freestanding and not supported by the artificial financial mechanisms which drive their proliferation and cause grief and hardship worldwide. But I didn't say that.
However, let me ask you something. You ask for an "alternative solution".
Question 1 - What do you perceive is the problem that requires a solution?
Question 2 - What precisely is your solution to that problem and how, through your own detailed inquiries, have you come to that conclusion?
ywindythesecond
10-Nov-12, 00:04
I also expressed concerns over the same issue and I subsequently received a satisfactory information sheet in the post that alleviated my fears.
Hi Reggy, long time. Could you tell us what your concern was and how it was resolved please?
Hi Reggy, long time. Could you tell us what your concern was and how it was resolved please?
Yes, no problem
http://forum.caithness.org/showthread.php?190361-Any-one-else-reckon-enough-is-enough&p=986552#post986552
ywindythesecond
10-Nov-12, 19:44
Yes, no problem
http://forum.caithness.org/showthread.php?190361-Any-one-else-reckon-enough-is-enough&p=986552#post986552
Thanks. I should have read it better.
9. What about birds?
The RSPB state in their leaflet, Wind Farms and Birds: "Climate change is the most significant, long-term threat to biodiversity worldwide. To help tackle this threat, the RSPB strongly supports moves to increase energy efficiency, reduce energy demand and supply more of our energy needs from renewable sources, including wind power, provided they do not harm birds or their habitats."
They went on to say that: "In the UK, we have not so far witnessed any major adverse effects on birds associated with wind farms."
The RSPB has said that from its own studies at three wind farms in Wales, "the scale of bird strike does not seem to be of serious concern", and that wind turbines will have little impact on birds outside main migration routes. Siting is a crucial issue and developers should contact specialists such as the RSPB and conduct a thorough analysis of the risk to birdlife as part of the EIA. Similarly, there is no evidence to suggest damage to other wildlife or agricultural livestock, which often graze right up to the turbines."
Friends of the Earth commented: "There is no conclusive evidence that wind turbines present more of a danger to birds than other structures, such as pylons or roads, when properly sited."
http://www.limekilnwindfarm.co.uk/your-concerns-addressed.aspx#Q1050
Aaaahh - 'developer speak' is all so couthie and cosy isn't it?
Let's firstly see if RSPB object to Limekiln or not, before jumping to the conclusion that everything will be OK.
Aaaahh - 'developer speak' is all so couthie and cosy isn't it?
Let's firstly see if RSPB object to Limekiln or not, before jumping to the conclusion that everything will be OK.
I think you will find that they were just quoting the words of the RSPB. Alas, the usual crap from anti-wind activists is that if the RSPB don't object then they are pro-wind.
ywindythesecond
17-Nov-12, 09:38
I think you will find that they were just quoting the words of the RSPB. Alas, the usual crap from anti-wind activists is that if the RSPB don't object then they are pro-wind.
If it is in the Developers ES it must be true. These are professional and honest people.
See all the words below which avoid telling us that it is us the punters who pay the subsidy they the developers get to be motivated to trash Reay.
http://www.limekilnwindfarm.co.uk/yo...sed.aspx#Q1050 (http://www.limekilnwindfarm.co.uk/your-concerns-addressed.aspx#Q1050)
11. Are wind farms built with taxpayers' money? How does the ROCs system work?
The UK wind industry is financed by private investment - there is no government subsidy for building wind farms. The support mechanism, known as Renewable Obligations Certificates (ROC), is only available for electricity that wind farms have already produced and supplied to utilities. All forms of renewable and non-renewable energy receive subsidies in one form or another. The Nuclear Industry has received £70billion in Government subsidy for its decommissioning programme. Conventional fossil fuels such as oil and gas receive tax breaks for exploration and research and development. Renewables Obligation Certificates (ROCs) are issued by Ofgem, the organisation that regulates the electricity and gas markets in Great Britain. ROCs have been designed to increase the profitability of renewable energy generation in order to help meet national and regional renewable energy targets.
A ROC is a green certificate issued to an accredited generator for eligible renewable electricity generated within the United Kingdom and supplied to customers within the United Kingdom by a licensed electricity supplier. One ROC is issued for each megawatt hour (MWh) of eligible renewable output generated. The Renewables Obligation, the Renewables Obligation Scotland and the Northern Ireland Renewables Obligation are designed to incentivise renewable generation into the electricity generation market. These schemes were introduced by the Department of Trade and Industry, the Scottish Executive and the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Investment respectively and are administered by the Gas and Electricity Markets Authority (whose day to day functions are performed by Ofgem (http://www.ofgem.gov.uk/Sustainability/Environmnt/RenewablObl/Pages/RenewablObl.aspx)).
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