View Full Version : unjust system
I am extremely distressed to note that i have been labled a puppet by the administrators on the sock puppet account thread. SMS my wife is being accused of using multiple names ie mine WATMAN. Why did my wife not receive a private message instead of naming and shaming her when she is completely innocent and branding her such politically incorrect words as a puppet. My wife made a reply stating her innocence and it was deleted straight away, so it is ok for the chosen few to target certain users by publicly humiluating them and then showing their authority by removing any replys made to protest their innocence?
This thread like the other one will probably be deleted straight away so i may just have to put an advert in the groat
connieb19
10-Dec-06, 12:48
The sock puppet thing is just to take the attention away from the real issue.
Childish tatics to draw the attention away from the real issue here.:roll:
The timing is interesting. However, my wife and I are both on and we use the same PC. All you have to do is let the admins know and they will flag it in their system.
why is it only some appear on the lists and they have added a select few to go on the systems ignore list. Why did they feel the need to name and shame just some off us?[disgust] I emailed niall sometime ago.
All this was to take the heat away from the real issue.
I see my name crop up on every page but i won't be apologizing or is it a crime to let friends and family use my computer.:confused
I have to agree that it is unjust my alleged sock puppet and myself both declared that we used the same pc long ago when Niall first requested info if anyone shared a pc , he also said that those that did not would be outed on the board so why are we being treated this way????
It is unfair!
I dont know how they can get away with naming and shaming innocent people like that. Cant two different users use the same computer in a household without being branded a fraud?
My wife and i regularly use this site, we are no longer in caithness and its good to feel part of the community whilst we are away but when things like this happen it puts you off.
The computer i use is for deprived locals and teenagers who dont have access nor can afford their own pc. There is multiple users accessing this site from here. Many have had their user names withdrawn or banned for no reason, now it is clear why. What is the problem with x amount of users registered by the same pc???? or indeed one person having 2 names.
If Misters Fernies or any of his non-corrupt moderators want to come down to this centre and install some much needed computers free of charge it will be greatly appreciated, then maybe more members of our community that use this one could hold on to their id on this site more more than a day.
porshiepoo
10-Dec-06, 14:10
You know what we should do about it?
LAUGH :lol:
Bombard it with people logging in and out and hope it'll crash, better still lets all join with numerous more names. Childish I know, but so's being called a sock puppet. [evil]
On the other side of the coin, aren't they just doing what we asked for recently??????? Could it be said that they're opening things up for us to see??
Don't shoot me down, I'm just trying to look at this from both sides - possibly for the first ever. lol
You know what we should do about it?
LAUGH :lol:
You know what, i joined this forum as i was a lurker, and an ex Caithnessian (right word?:confused ) because all though I'm from cheshire, i love caithness, its people, and its beauty, me being english, when i moved to caithness i expected to find the stereotypical "english haters" , but instead i found the most caring, trusting and welcoming people i have ever met, i went to the local pub near reay (back then) and i expected the pub to go silent, but instead one of the locals shouted "buy that man a drink" , before i'd utterd a word, and in less than 30 mins id made 40 new freinds, that kind of warmth brings a smile to my face even though i'm back in cheshire, and what ive seen going on on this forum recently is souring my memories of caithness and its people. Please dont do that as my Caithness memorios are some of the best i have.
Cant we let sleeping dogs lie?
I don't see the point in that forum, to be honest.
porshiepoo
10-Dec-06, 14:47
You know what, i joined this forum as i was a lurker, and an ex Caithnessian (right word?:confused ) because all though I'm from cheshire, i love caithness, its people, and its beauty, me being english, when i moved to caithness i expected to find the stereotypical "english haters" , but instead i found the most caring, trusting and welcoming people i have ever met, i went to the local pub near reay (back then) and i expected the pub to go silent, but instead one of the locals shouted "buy that man a drink" , before i'd utterd a word, and in less than 30 mins id made 40 new freinds, that kind of warmth brings a smile to my face even though i'm back in cheshire, and what ive seen going on on this forum recently is souring my memories of caithness and its people. Please dont do that as my Caithness memorios are some of the best i have.
Cant we let sleeping dogs lie?
Huh?
Whats that got to do with what I put? Seeing as you quoted me and all!
I ain't trying to taint anyones memory of here - I live here, it's fantastic.
Don't start going off on tangents and thinking what is said about the way this forum is run should go into a persons personal memory of Caithness.
p.s Stark, I'm english too.
The timing is interesting. However, my wife and I are both on and we use the same PC. All you have to do is let the admins know and they will flag it in their system.Which i did some time ago and many other probably did too .
jinglejangle
10-Dec-06, 15:09
As i see it the 'sock puppet' section is Colin and Niall trying to make things more open after all the furore the other night.
I don't see why some people are offended - if you have 2 users in your house just say that - no harm done. I would say the only people that should be offended are those that have 2 accounts for the same person.
I had a quick look through the sock puppet pages and found it ironic that unicorn's husband joined on 7 December and she left on 8 December.
I'm hanging up my Sock Puppet for Christmas,
I'm hanging it beside the Christmas Tree,
I'm hanging up my Sock Puppet for Christmas,
And Stuffing the big Turkey.
Let's all hang up our Sock puppet,
Hang them for all to see,
Let's all hang up our Sock Puppet
And Stir up a cake for tea.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I had no idea what a Sock Puppet was !
Was that thread really meant to humiliate us ? GREAT !
My street cred has gone up - just wait till I tell the grandchildren !
Such a nice Christmas Present.
he he he
Colin Manson
10-Dec-06, 15:16
I have to agree that it is unjust my alleged sock puppet and myself both declared that we used the same pc long ago when Niall first requested info if anyone shared a pc , he also said that those that did not would be outed on the board so why are we being treated this way????
It is unfair!
Nicnak, you've got it the wrong way around, Niall said that it wasn't to be used that way. It's to prevent forum abuse, once all the genuine account have been added to the ignore list the system will just detect those attempting to abuse the system by creating numerous accounts.
As i see it the 'sock puppet' section is Colin and Niall trying to make things more open after all the furore the other night.
Nice to see that someone can see the change as a good thing, seems as if we are blamed whatever we do.
My prob here is that we had already told niall so we should be on the ignore list not put on another list
as said before I am unicorns husband.On the 7th she had no problems here. She has no intentions of coming back after what happened on the 8th. I have no interest in this site after what happened but just wanted to defend my wife's name. If you check her posts you will know I collect corgi lorries so that is why this name was chosen. This reply is far milder than I want. As she didn't know what would happen on the 8th and the account was created just before we went to bed she had not private mailed the administrators to tell them and had planned to tell them of both accounts the next day.
jinglejangle
10-Dec-06, 15:29
as said before I am unicorns husband.On the 7th she had no problems here. She has no intentions of coming back after what happened on the 8th. I have no interest in this site after what happened but just wanted to defend my wife's name. If you check her posts you will know I collect corgi lorries so that is why this name was chosen. This reply is far milder than I want. As she didn't know what would happen on the 8th and the account was created just before we went to bed she had not private mailed the administrators to tell them and had planned to tell them of both accounts the next day.
It's ok corgiman - i wasn't doubting you :D
Colin Manson
10-Dec-06, 15:41
My prob here is that we had already told niall so we should be on the ignore list not put on another list
Yes but he hasn't had time to do that for everyone, it'll be done ASAP.
Huh?
Whats that got to do with what I put? Seeing as you quoted me and all!
I ain't trying to taint anyones memory of here - I live here, it's fantastic.
Don't start going off on tangents and thinking what is said about the way this forum is run should go into a persons personal memory of Caithness.
p.s Stark, I'm english too.
Thats not what i meant..
oh i dunno..
Rmember, the AE sock puppet detector is automatic... you can see that from the wording. Niall and co need to place the legitimate multiusers into an ignore list (and that will take time) then they won't crop up again. Even though some of you told Niall personally, the automated system still popped you out until it has been told to ignore you.
I think it is a good step towards making the system more transparent to us the users (that's transparent, not invisible, by the way) and we can all then see who may be using 'ghost' accounts.
As i see it the 'sock puppet' section is Colin and Niall trying to make things more open after all the furore the other night.
I don't see why some people are offended - if you have 2 users in your house just say that - no harm done. I would say the only people that should be offended are those that have 2 accounts for the same person.
I had a quick look through the sock puppet pages and found it ironic that unicorn's husband joined on 7 December and she left on 8 December.
I dont see a problem with one person having two or more names,whats the problem and who is it hurting??? and why is it called sock puppeting? and why is it scorned upon by the powers that be??
Highland Laddie
10-Dec-06, 16:47
where is the link to this sockpuppet thing ???
It is right at the beginning of the org pages. Sock Puppet Accounts (http://forum.caithness.org/forumdisplay.php?f=76)
I dont see a problem with one person having two or more names,whats the problem and who is it hurting???
yes but why should someone feel the need to post under diffrent names?
yes but why should someone feel the need to post under diffrent names?
i dont know why, i was only asking who it was hurting and why it was deemed a .org crime.
Highland Laddie
10-Dec-06, 16:59
It is right at the beginning of the org pages. Sock Puppet Accounts (http://forum.caithness.org/forumdisplay.php?f=76)
Many thanks.
i dont know why, i was only asking who it was hurting and why it was deemed a .org crime.
It's a crime on most forums, donnas, because it is one method of disrupting a forum. Seems to be no need for any one person to have more than one identity if he/she isn't intending to flame.
If it is necessary because they have forgotten their login and rejoined, or something, then they should make the fact known.
I've been on a forum where there were long posts from a couple of "members" keeping each other going, getting others involved and causing mayhem with their flaming............only for us to find out that they were the same person talking to themselves...........because the person wasn't bright enough to stop posting photos in both names..from the same online account!
But it took a wee whilie before anyone thought to check the photo properties, and in the meantime, a lot of trouble was caused.
As i see it the 'sock puppet' section is Colin and Niall trying to make things more open after all the furore the other night.
I don't see why some people are offended - if you have 2 users in your house just say that - no harm done. I would say the only people that should be offended are those that have 2 accounts for the same person.
I had a quick look through the sock puppet pages and found it ironic that unicorn's husband joined on 7 December and she left on 8 December.
My wife and i have not been on the org for at least two months since moving away and yes we are offended. How were we meant to know that we were supposed to tell if we had two users using the same computer? This is such a stupid and unfair system. What is it to do with the administrators how many people use my computer? I can understand wanting to shame abusers of the system but the only abusers in this instance are the administrators.
What gives them the right to call us and many others puppets without any evidence. Certain administrators have caused mayhem on this site with their antics. In the two months we have been away from caithness we were looking forward to getting back on to the org to get the crack and went out and bought a new laptop. Since logging back on it has proved nothing more than an insult and we demand a public appology from the administration as they so quickly publicly made us look so bad
jinglejangle
10-Dec-06, 18:29
I dont see a problem with one person having two or more names,whats the problem and who is it hurting??? and why is it called sock puppeting? and why is it scorned upon by the powers that be??
i agree - i don't have a problem with people having 2 names but if they do why don't they want others to know? why does someone need to have 2 names anyway?
jinglejangle
10-Dec-06, 18:33
My wife and i have not been on the org for at least two months since moving away and yes we are offended. How were we meant to know that we were supposed to tell if we had two users using the same computer? This is such a stupid and unfair system. What is it to do with the administrators how many people use my computer? I can understand wanting to shame abusers of the system but the only abusers in this instance are the administrators.
What gives them the right to call us and many others puppets without any evidence. Certain administrators have caused mayhem on this site with their antics. In the two months we have been away from caithness we were looking forward to getting back on to the org to get the crack and went out and bought a new laptop. Since logging back on it has proved nothing more than an insult and we demand a public appology from the administration as they so quickly publicly made us look so bad
sorry if you feel insulted - my message didn't meant to do that. I don't know where the term sock puppet has come from - maybe it is a computer term which is used on forums world-wide - don't know? However I feel that people like yourselves have no need to be embarrassed - there is nothing wrong in you and your wife having 2 separate accounts - all you need to do is let the administrators know. After Friday night and all the complaints I think the administrators have decided to let things become more open and therefore are trying to clear out the ghost accounts - but there is nothing wrong with what you and your wife have done. :lol:
connieb19
10-Dec-06, 18:34
i agree - i don't have a problem with people having 2 names but if they do why don't they want others to know? why does someone need to have 2 names anyway?
I had 2 names. I used a different name to advertise things on the classifieds because I had my home and mobile number on the posts when I was selling something. I emailed Niall when I registered the second name as it was said that this was allowed. I did not expect posts with my telephone number to be connected to this name. :mad:
jinglejangle
10-Dec-06, 18:37
I had 2 names. I used a different name to advertise things on the classifieds because I had my home and mobile number on the posts when I was selling something. I emailed Niall when I registered the second name as it was said that this was allowed. I did not expect posts with my telephone number to be connected to this name. :mad:
That sounds fair enough although i wouldn't put my home telephone number on any posts - I think using PM's is a better way of doing things. Cheers for that connie :)
rich62_uk
10-Dec-06, 18:39
I stopped posting a long time ago for my own reasons, however, I seem to of been dragged into this with a MINOR no less (amazing what desperate folk will do). It took ages for me to reply as for some reason IT ALL WENT SLOW .........Read below,
Nail put -
young_fishin_neep seems to have multiple personalities using rich62_uk (http://forum.caithness.org/member.php?u=2510) and young_fishin_neep (http://forum.caithness.org/member.php?u=3109) sharing the same computer. No soup for you! and you! and you!
1Hour Ago
young_fishin_neep (http://forum.caithness.org/member.php?u=3109) vbmenu_register("postmenu_170391", true);
.Orger
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: scrabster
Posts: 150
i am not at home ( living with tugmistress this week and whole of next week) i just pop home to see the dogs. i am staying with rich62_uk and we both post on the org, or is it a crime to post when at another persons house ?
kaz xx
__________________
kaz
1 Minute Ago
rich62_uk (http://forum.caithness.org/member.php?u=2510) vbmenu_register("postmenu_170480", true);
.Orger
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 202
Hi nail,
Seems like your AE detector is a little over sensative, young_fishin_neep is visiting us for a few days whilst her mother (yes she is a minor) is away, whilst I am sure that this is standard practice for you to name and shame sock accounts, I find it strange after the recent accusations regarding your moderators that this should be a time you choose to name and shame, I really dont believe this will detract from the horrendous behavour of the moderators APPOINTED BY YOURSELF, and thought a little more of you than to use such pathetic ploys to detract from what I must say must be one of the biggest scandals on your site, the good news is when you remove my message no doubt you will remove the horrendous accusations you have made againts me.
Regard Rich62_uk.
no doubt to be soon an ex-orger if your regime continues in its normal vein.
__________________
" He was a funny plump little man who looked as though he had been poured into his suit and somebody had forgotten to say when "...
connieb19
10-Dec-06, 18:39
That sounds fair enough although i wouldn't put my home telephone number on any posts - I think using PM's is a better way of doing things. Cheers for that connie :)The reason I put my number is that there are some who view the for sale stuff who havn't registered so cannot contact you by pm so if there's no number there's no sale.
jinglejangle
10-Dec-06, 18:43
The reason I put my number is that there are some who view the for sale stuff who havn't registered so cannot contact you by pm so if there's no number there's no sale.
Connie of course - never thought of that.
So as many of you know I work offshore When my wife logs on will that register as a sock puppet.Not that she uses it a lot these days but if she comes into the chat will it restrict our access? If so Thats stupid!
connieb19
10-Dec-06, 18:45
Connie of course - never thought of that.
Lol I only thought about it because it happened to me before I joined, I was so frustrated because I wanted to by something but had no way of contacting them.
You know what, i joined this forum as i was a lurker, and an ex Caithnessian (right word?:confused ) because all though I'm from cheshire, i love caithness, its people, and its beauty, me being english, when i moved to caithness i expected to find the stereotypical "english haters" , but instead i found the most caring, trusting and welcoming people i have ever met, i went to the local pub near reay (back then) and i expected the pub to go silent, but instead one of the locals shouted "buy that man a drink" , before i'd utterd a word, and in less than 30 mins id made 40 new freinds, that kind of warmth brings a smile to my face even though i'm back in cheshire, and what ive seen going on on this forum recently is souring my memories of caithness and its people. Please dont do that as my Caithness memorios are some of the best i have.
Cant we let sleeping dogs lie?Here here I have too agree the poeple here ra mongist the nicest I have ever met.:D
oldmarine
10-Dec-06, 22:32
I am extremely distressed to note that i have been labled a puppet by the administrators on the sock puppet account thread. SMS my wife is being accused of using multiple names ie mine WATMAN. Why did my wife not receive a private message instead of naming and shaming her when she is completely innocent and branding her such politically incorrect words as a puppet. My wife made a reply stating her innocence and it was deleted straight away, so it is ok for the chosen few to target certain users by publicly humiluating them and then showing their authority by removing any replys made to protest their innocence?
This thread like the other one will probably be deleted straight away so i may just have to put an advert in the groat
A private message would have been a better fit for this type of thing.
A private message would have been a better fit for this type of thing.
What they did to us was not very private was it?
Niall Fernie
11-Dec-06, 11:55
Can someone please point out where it says that accounts detected by the AE detector will be restricted in any way?
Naefearjustbeer
11-Dec-06, 12:44
I think the problem is the fact that people have been openly outed without any fair warning. Many folk have multiple users within the same house and may not want the 2 or more user names to be associated for a variety of valid reasons. This is what has bothered me and the fact that once an explanation has been given the thread has not been deleted from the forum.
Worst case scenario could be user X who is confrontational on the boards and makes a lot of enemies has a child with there own log in. All of a sudden said child gets associated with X and may end up getting harassed due to the views and postings of the parent. Now how does the law stand on children getting harassed on the net or even in public if X is known to folk in the community.
I think the problem is the fact that people have been openly outed without any fair warning. Many folk have multiple users within the same house and may not want the 2 or more user names to be associated for a variety of valid reasons. This is what has bothered me and the fact that once an explanation has been given the thread has not been deleted from the forum.
Worst case scenario could be user X who is confrontational on the boards and makes a lot of enemies has a child with there own log in. All of a sudden said child gets associated with X and may end up getting harassed due to the views and postings of the parent. Now how does the law stand on children getting harassed on the net or even in public if X is known to folk in the community.
I have to say, my account was flagged up when a visitor logged in on my pc. When I saw the thread, I added my explination and it was removed within minutes.
Naefearjustbeer
11-Dec-06, 13:40
I have to say, my account was flagged up when a visitor logged in on my pc. When I saw the thread, I added my explination and it was removed within minutes.
Not everyones was removed very quickly and as the MODs found out once one person sees something the damage is already done. My one disapeared but not after someone discovered who the other user in my house was. This was something I specifically did not want to happen, Due to the fact some people have been taking what I would call an unheathly interest in my internet usage and have been following my posts and things not only on this site but others too.
Not everyones was removed very quickly and as the MODs found out once one person sees something the damage is already done. My one disapeared but not after someone discovered who the other user in my house was. This was something I specifically did not want to happen, Due to the fact some people have been taking what I would call an unheathly interest in my internet usage and have been following my posts and things not only on this site but others too.
:eek: Fair point, Naefear, there are internet stalkers out there! Good reason for not using full names (as per Porshie's thread).
It seems a few people are feeling insulted by the term "sock puppet", and think maybe that it is a less-than-complimentary name that has been dreamed up by the Admin here. This is, in fact a widely used term (unfortunate as it is...I think the computer geeks who think these things up have interesting senses of humour! :lol:) for someone on an online community who has multiple accounts...for whatever reason, innocent or not (though on a net-wide basis, cases are more often for malicious intent).
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_sock_puppet
The AE detector will automatically pick up any accounts logged onto the forum from the same computer, and that Niall and Colin are wanting to sort out who might have legitimate reasons for this is a good thing. They can then get the system to ignore it happening on husband/wife accounts, etc. I can say that having the AE detector posts made public in order to implement this was not a problem for myself and Saltire, though I can understand how and why it might be for someone else.
Naefearjustbeer
11-Dec-06, 14:25
:eek: Fair point, Naefear, there are internet stalkers out there! Good reason for not using full names (as per Porshie's thread).
I am not too bothered if anyone knows who I am. I think I am sort of infamous in some circles. However it is not for the forum to out me! Or anyone else who happens to use my internet connection.
weeboyagee
11-Dec-06, 15:06
Can someone please point out where it says that accounts detected by the AE detector will be restricted in any way?
It doesn't - and I don't know why people are being so offended.
I emailed the admin and let them know that Alice In Blunderland and me (weeboyagee) were going to be using the same computer for a while. Niall acknowledged it and no more was said.
A few days ago the detector caught the multiple use of the computer that we are on. No big problem - I think I have enough sense to know that as soon as it was employed it would catch us both on the same computer.
There is no shame in being caught by this tool of forum administration if you have nothing to hide - it is there to help maintain the forum and protect all it's users from those who set up multiple accounts to cause mayhem.
I agree that private messages are a better way of asking for clarification and gaining the facts before publicly posting your outrage, disgust or disappointment. The issue may not be as serious or as big as you're reading into.
WBG :cool:
Naefearjustbeer
11-Dec-06, 15:29
It is serious, I have valid personal reasons for keeping IDs on this site private. I dont care about my ID as it is farly well known amongst this site and other web forums. However someone else who used my computer has been contacted directly after this forum highlighted the fact asking if they knew me and how did they know me. 2 and 2 were correctly put together after the new system highlighted the fact. Luckily it was ok as the person asking was a friend but there are users on this site that I do not want under any circumstances to get that same info. Luckily the info has now disapeared from the thread in question. I am not happy about it and nothing will appease my displeasure about this incident.[evil]
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