View Full Version : 100% Scottish?
Did anyone watch tonight's programme, 100% English? I enjoyed seeing the surprised looks on each of the interviewee's faces when they were told that their DNA profile didn't exactly match what they thought was English. Their profile had mixes of all parts of the Globe from North American, African-Subsaharan to South Asian. One woman even went to the extent of making legal proceedings against the programme for what she thought were inaccurate findings after being told she had a big part of Romany genes in her![lol]
Good old Norman Tebbit was 100% European though. No bike there then?:roll:
I would love to know what mine is, the more exotic the better. For me a part of Englishness is the fact that they are a mongrel nation. Other things is the language and the recognition of the power of Parliamentary elected state officals over those of God and King. An ability to laugh viciously at oneself and others with equal parity.
I know what the programmes makers were trying to do, they were trying to pick on people who thought that race/skin colour had a part of what their Englishness is all about and thus tried to expose any racist confusions. For me it is a trivial matter but it was good seeing those faces of surprise though.
The principle with 100% Scottish will be the same and I can't see any difference in the range of racial mix with those who thought they were 100% Caithnessian...
My mother has a dark complexion, so I guess there is some far off genetic trait there! ;-) I wonder where I can get a test done?
Dreadnought
07-Dec-06, 00:59
It was a channel 4 programme, and as such was heavily slanted to paint 'the English' in a bad light, as they usually like to do. The fact that the channel 4 Christmas message will be read by a Muslim woman in full veil this year is proof of this.
I wonder if you would be so philosophical if they had tried to tear apart the Scottish identity.
MrBurd and I were chatting with an archaeologist at Ephesus, who was convinced I was Turkish/Mediterranean. And I’m as Caithness as they come, especially when I open my gob!
I would love to know where the distinctive dark (dark/black hair/ brown eyes/ olive toned skin) characteristics come from. It was always been the standing joke that some Spanish sailor had a look in at some point, but being a Roman sounds so much more exotic [lol] !
I'm vexed I missed the show, it sounds interesting...
I'm vexed I missed the show, it sounds interesting...
Try having a look on the Channel 4 website, there may be a synopsis of the programme.
I'm with you Rheghead, I'd love to find out about genetic make up also.
I didn't see the programme but if Channel Four were involved I can imagine that they had gone out of their way to invent some kind of "contraversial" aspect to it.
I'm not sure it was on C4 now, I just flicked and chanced upon it!:confused
Try having a look on the Channel 4 website, there may be a synopsis of the programme.
Thanks Rheghead, hmmm, maybe it'll be repeated on More4 at some point? I'll go and have a rummage on the net!
George Brims
07-Dec-06, 01:35
This reminds me of the 1970s when the National Front had a brief period of prominence, and one of their supporters placed a sticker in a public loo I visited. It read "No to a multi-racial Britain!". Underneath someone had written "I agree. Send the Anglo-Saxons back. They've been nothing but trouble. Signed, A. Pict"
Despite the Old Norse surname, I too have that dark hair/olive skin look that's quite common in Caithness.
My daughter did a college paper on the project in Iceland to test the DNA of as many people as possible, to make use of the fact everyone there knows their ancestry back through many generations (they've already identified many genetic disease markers through the project). Many of the Icelanders were surprised to find how much of their makeup came from other parts of the world. The Viking habit of bringing back slaves from their raids is thought to be mostly responsible.
Loved the comment about The Aglo-Saxons gbrims.
I was amazed to read recently that so many inhabitants of these islands have Viking blood mixed with The Celtic.
Well all I can say is that I am short and square..they bred us that way so we would fit down the tin mines but the majority of folks from the far south west of these islands have dark hair, fair skins and eyes that shade from bright blue to deep grey.
OHHHHHH maybe you are "The dark Highlander" of Neil Gunn's books!
Dreadnought
07-Dec-06, 02:18
Well my father, my brother and I are all 6'3", blond and blue eyed. My family name (on my fathers' side) is centred on the south coast around East Sussex. The name itself originates in Europe in the Jutland region. So my guess is we came over with Hengist and Horsa and are either Angles or Saxons (more likely Saxons).
Btw, England is named for the Angles, East Anglia, Angle-land, Angland, England.
I havnt got the least bit of interest about where I came from before I was born. That's as dangerous a virus as religion. In fact it's probably more dangerous.
Nationalism, racism and silly little boys changing street signs in Edinburgh are all by-products of wheredidicomefromism.
The truth is we all come form the same place.
The sooner this type of romantic nonsense is turfed into Room 101 the sooner the world will get on with the real business of knowing where we are and more importantly where we are going. [disgust]
I saw part of the programme, which I did find a bit disturbing in the way these people were willing to go on record telling people that were not "pure blood english" (as if such a thing existed) that they were some type of mongrel not entitled to consider themselves at the same level as those of pure lines. Smacks of eugenics and shouldn't be given the time of day, even if only to have them proven wrong.
"Home is neither here nor there. Home is within you, or home is nowhere at all." ( Hesse I believe........ or maybe neitze because I was into both at the same time a long time ago). We all make our little niches, create our own bonds and found our families, making our homes and become ourselves, be they where we were born or elsewhere. Having lived in 5 different countries ( counting Scotland and England as 2) it's been the "elsewhere's" that have made my life all the more richer.
Did anyone watch tonight's programme, 100% English? I enjoyed seeing the surprised looks on each of the interviewee's faces when they were told that their DNA profile didn't exactly match what they thought was English. Their profile had mixes of all parts of the Globe from North American, African-Subsaharan to South Asian. One woman even went to the extent of making legal proceedings against the programme for what she thought were inaccurate findings after being told she had a big part of Romany genes in her![lol]
Good old Norman Tebbit was 100% European though. No bike there then?:roll:
I would love to know what mine is, the more exotic the better. For me a part of Englishness is the fact that they are a mongrel nation. Other things is the language and the recognition of the power of Parliamentary elected state officals over those of God and King. An ability to laugh viciously at oneself and others with equal parity.
I know what the programmes makers were trying to do, they were trying to pick on people who thought that race/skin colour had a part of what their Englishness is all about and thus tried to expose any racist confusions. For me it is a trivial matter but it was good seeing those faces of surprise though.
The principle with 100% Scottish will be the same and I can't see any difference in the range of racial mix with those who thought they were 100% Caithnessian...
My mother has a dark complexion, so I guess there is some far off genetic trait there! ;-) I wonder where I can get a test done?
Very good article in P and J of 15th November on this topic and tells where to get DNA testing done and cost. Let me know if you want details!
Or just do a search .
http://www.dna-worldwide.com/DNA-Testing-Direct/Ancestry-DNA-Testing
pultneytooner
07-Dec-06, 12:31
A 3rd of all white americans have african dna so I think it would be very hard to find any race that is pure caucassian.
And what does it matter anyway?
I believe that the Basques have good reason to claim to be the original Europeans.
They have their own unique language. It's origins are totally unknown and is "untainted" by the languages of later "European" usurpers.
"It's a wise child that knows it's own father!" as Shakespeare said.
Naefearjustbeer
07-Dec-06, 14:41
Does it really matter what your background is, I think we should all take each other for what we are in the present day. Not the fact that you may have romany or whatever blood in your make up. We are all mongrels in some way or other and I doubt very much if there are many pure Scots. After all what is a pure Scot? There must be a lot of viking blood flowing in Caithness. Those that are pure bread probally have genetic defects after all look what selective inbreeding has done to many breeds of dog. Lots of alsations with bad hips. Other breeds have eye trouble etc.
In fact I seem to remember reading about an area in America where they were cut off from outsiders ie new blood and the people ended up with a blue tinge to them because of the restricted gene pool. Diversity makes us what we are.
ps I hope I have no english blood in me ;) :evil
I agree with the comments against racism.
However, it is of interest to know the history of the people of a region. It can also be fascinating to find out your own particular mix and the programme you are discussing clearly made people re-think (even if they are not on the right track yet) about their own, personal heritage.
To condemn a particular subject because some people get the wrong ideas about it is also wrong.
Perhaps the dark hair and other traits have some connection with Egypt. You know the legend that Princess Scota arrived here from Egypt and how this gave rise to the names Scot and Scotland. This is the same tale that links the real Stone of Destiny, not that piece of rubble in Edinburgh Castle, with Scotland and the Middle East. The stone is also known as Jacob's Pillow.
Has anyone else noticed the similarity between the sounds of the Gaelic singing at a church service and the sounds of singing in the Middle East?
Does it really matter what your background is, I think we should all take each other for what we are in the present day. Not the fact that you may have romany or whatever blood in your make up. We are all mongrels in some way or other and I doubt very much if there are many pure Scots. After all what is a pure Scot? There must be a lot of viking blood flowing in Caithness. Those that are pure bread probally have genetic defects after all look what selective inbreeding has done to many breeds of dog. Lots of alsations with bad hips. Other breeds have eye trouble etc.
In fact I seem to remember reading about an area in America where they were cut off from outsiders ie new blood and the people ended up with a blue tinge to them because of the restricted gene pool. Diversity makes us what we are.
ps I hope I have no english blood in me ;) :evil
You are right it does not matter one bit but I have an interest in all things historic - local history, family history, development of the peoples of the world, where we all came from, etc., etc, etc. Absolutely no connection with racism but just a fun and a curisoity to see what we are peoples of the world are all about. Since we are all in this world descended from 36 tribal mothers, according to the Oxford Ancestors project, and provablle through DNA then racial distinction becomes a bit of non-story.
Naefearjustbeer
07-Dec-06, 15:23
You are right it does not matter one bit but I have an interest in all things historic - local history, family history, development of the peoples of the world, where we all came from, etc., etc, etc. Absolutely no connection with racism but just a fun and a curisoity to see what we are peoples of the world are all about. Since we are all in this world descended from 36 tribal mothers, according to the Oxford Ancestors project, and provablle through DNA then racial distinction becomes a bit of non-story.
I can see where the interest can be but it was the attitude of the woman in Rhegheads post about taking legal action about the findings is what stirred me up. I also think up until the days of dounreay caithness probably had quite a unique make up as apart from viking arriving our little part of the world would of been fairly isolated from the rest of the uk. We do still to this day have some fairly unique families in the area who can probably maintain a fairly pure caithness bloodline quite far back into history.
But apart from that we are all distant cousins and as such the only thing separating us is religion and colour. The 2 biggest causes of conflict on the planet. Although religion probally is at the root excuse of more trouble than colour.
"It's a wise child that knows it's own father!" as Shakespeare said.
"We are all Jock Tamsons Bairns" allegedly said by the Rev John Thomson of Duddingston Kirk circa 1850's
percy toboggan
07-Dec-06, 18:30
[quote=Rheghead;168404]
.....Good old Norman Tebbit was 100% European though. No bike there then?:roll:
......I know what the programmes makers were trying to do, they were trying to pick on people who thought that race/skin colour had a part of what their Englishness is all about and thus tried to expose any racist confusions. For me it is a trivial matter.....[quote]
I was surprised none of them took the results to task. Are we all so blindly believing in this dna science? The keys to it are in so few hands. This programme had a definite agenda - ie. make some patriotic English people look stupid. I would have told them to get stiffed if I am allowed to say this on here. The only time they established a largely English dna (Tebbit) they described it as 'boring' - hardly objective.
Interesting.. I did not manage to see the programme but I was chatting to some of my students yesterday about racism and commented to them that a great deal of racist 'whites' would be horrified to discover that they all carried 'black' genes from distant ancestors. rofl when I read the above. :lol:
Dreadnought
07-Dec-06, 19:34
Interesting to see various posters assume racism is only a colour issue. There is white on white racism too, and this programme was racist towards the English. As usual Channel 4 went for the easy target. They wouldn't dare go for the Welsh, Scots or Irish, they wouldn't dare criticise British Muslims, or British Africans/Asians etc. no, they go for the English who alone among all the peoples of this island have no representation, and as such have no protection against such left wing PC racism.
As I said at the beginning of this thread: How philosophical would posters to this thread be if the programme had been doing a hatchet job on Scots ancestry?
percy toboggan
07-Dec-06, 19:45
Interesting to see various posters assume racism is only a colour issue. There is white on white racism too, and this programme was racist towards the English. As I said at the beginning of this thread: How philosophical would posters to this thread be if the programme had been doing a hatchet job on Scots ancestry?
I sometimes think the Scots are less prone to laugh at themselves as much as the English are. Given this then they might take some umbrage. I think the self deprecating nature of some English people - (often the lower socio-economic orders like me)is one of their most endearing qualities. I embrace it totally and often take 'the mick' out of myself. If that sounds Irish I make no apologies.
As I said at the beginning of this thread: How philosophical would posters to this thread be if the programme had been doing a hatchet job on Scots ancestry?
It must be a very naive person who thinks their bloodlines are pure, so I can't understand why anyone should have a problem with the proving of it.
I didn't see the programme, but if those being tested volunteered, then they got their five minutes of fame..........and paid the price.
How can stating the obvious be a hatchet job? :confused
Dreadnought
08-Dec-06, 00:23
I didn't see the programme, but if those being tested volunteered, then they got their five minutes of fame..........and paid the price.
How can stating the obvious be a hatchet job? :confused
Then you didn't see the way the programme revelled in tearing apart the English identity. The one person whose test came back as typically 'English', Norman Tebbit, had his results described as 'boring'.
I would have had more respect for the programme's results had it tested people from all four nations, rather than just singling out the English. But asIaready said, Channel 4 are too cowardly to take on anyone who has proper representation.
Then you didn't see the way the programme revelled in tearing apart the English identity.
I saw something totally different in the programme. I didn't think it had a go at the English identity, rather, it had a go at people who thought that racial purity had anything to do with who they are.
Yes, they singled out the English, but anyone with a grain of intelligence could appreciate that the same arguement could apply to any nationality, it just so happened that it was a programme on British TV of which 80% of viewers are probably English.
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