View Full Version : smoking shopkeepers
Ballymore
17-Aug-12, 21:59
Anyone else annoyed with proprieters smoking in the doorways of their shops or walking around with mugs of tea whilst serving customers? Nonchalance and bad manners - little wonder this shop has fewer and fewer customers.
Time they were smoked out then :-)
this would not be a shop in wick by any chance
Anyone else annoyed with proprieters smoking in the doorways of their shops or walking around with mugs of tea whilst serving customers? Nonchalance and bad manners - little wonder this shop has fewer and fewer customers.
Well, seeing as you're asking, no.
this would not be a shop in wick by any chance
Pretty sure it is and pretty certain I know which one. I really like the stuff the shop sells but I avoid it now, I am rarely even in Wick yet every time I go there they are puffing away, no thanks will order online instead.
[QUOTE=Serenity;970703]Pretty sure it is and pretty certain I know which one. I really like the stuff the shop sells but I avoid it now, I am rarely even in Wick yet every time I go there they are puffing away, no thanks will order online instead you are the same as me and when you go in they are always on you so you can not look properly and like you order on line
im sick of just about any public place that has staff who smoke. usually have to wade through the clouds of the stuff to get into the place when they are on their cig break. likewise pubs with doorways full of puffing drunks! worst is of shops who have staff that are more happier talking on their mobile than serving people and it isnt the first time i've dumped my goods and walked out
you are the same as me and when you go in they are always on you so you can not look properly and like you order on line
Definitely the same shop. The last time I was in there I was looking for some items, they were out smoking when I went in and then pretty sharpish were on me like a limpet asking if I needed any help. Yes please, could I look at your items without being surrounded by a foul smoke smell please.
Do you all really judge a person on whether they smoke or not? I would object more if they smoked IN the shop. You can't have it all ways; either they are smoking and ignoring you, or they are all over you offering help? You know you will eventually get the town centres you deserve when there is nothing left but charity shops and boarded windows. I am one of the customers who walk round the shop drinking coffee, which is always on offer to anyone who comes in. So put your claws in and support the shops are hanging on by their fingertips or else you soon won't have any left.
Do you all really judge a person on whether they smoke or not? I would object more if they smoked IN the shop. You can't have it all ways; either they are smoking and ignoring you
No I don't judge people on that. But I don't expect someone who has just been smoking to then come and shadow me and surround me with their toxic fumes.
And I want it neither of those ways. There is an obvious happy medium between no attention and too much attention. Like the way most shop staff realise that most people want. Attention there for when the customer wants it. So be at the till or at least in the shop. If a customer is asked if they need help and say no, leave them be.
I must admit the way I was being shadowed last time made me wonder if they have a shoplifting problem, and I thought at the time this was most likely due to them being outside leaving opportune thieves free.
And like I have said I do like the shop so if they are hanging on by their fingertips maybe they should take the issues on board, I have had several pms confirming exactly which shop it is and so I think most people know. I know coffee/tea mugs were mentioned, I don't have an issue with that. It is the smoking and stalking that put me off. I would rather buy locally than online, but I cannot use that shop as it is.
Maybe if you have a word with the owner and express to them your discomfort about the situation, people aren't mind readers and probably aren't aware that there is an issue
Shop offering coffee..do they do tea?
No seriously I hate being followed round a shop, but, if Im clueless I love to be able to ask for a hand..and get help.
As for the smoking outside when the shop is empty ..so what ...its obviously break time...and if a customer goes in the staff do too...chewing gum or mints might be a thought though...as well as sitting at the till etc for a wee min or 2...waiting for signs the person needs help...then asking and helping if needing or backing off with the words no thanks or Im browsing.
Tinkerbell09
19-Aug-12, 01:04
First it was moan moan moan about smoking indoors, and that came to an end. Now it's smoking outdoors. There is no keeping non-smokers happy these days!
Tinkerbell09
19-Aug-12, 01:39
Why don't you complain to the person rather than slate the shop off while everyone know's who your talking about?! All you anti-smokers got what you wanted when we were banned from smoking inside, if you really dispise it that much, cross the street! We have the right to smoke outside, it's up to you if you walk through our clouds or not!
rogermellie
19-Aug-12, 01:56
All you anti-smokers got what you wanted when we were banned from smoking inside
you can slowly kill yourself and smell like dirt in your own space, not ours, you're the minority, why should we put up with your poisonous stink ?
i told one of the ladies months back when i was waiting to be served while she finished her fag, she gave no apology and laughed about the smoking law being bad for business !!
having a fag right outside the entrance gives a bad impression and the smokey smell (you smokers can't smell it) is dragged into the shop in their clothes
i could name umpteen shops and have even seen nurses having a fag outside the hospital, it's not isolated to this one shop, but maybe their position makes them more visible than others, that being the case, they should be discreet/cut back on the fags
Tinkerbell09
19-Aug-12, 02:16
you can slowly kill yourself and smell like dirt in your own space, not ours, you're the minority, why should we put up with your poisonous stink ?
i told one of the ladies months back when i was waiting to be served while she finished her fag, she gave no apology and laughed about the smoking law being bad for business !!
having a fag right outside the entrance gives a bad impression and the smokey smell (you smokers can't smell it) is dragged into the shop in their clothes
i could name umpteen shops and have even seen nurses having a fag outside the hospital, it's not isolated to this one shop, but maybe their position makes them more visible than others, that being the case, they should be discreet/cut back on the fags
I've heard this speech 101 times about slowly killing myself, and you can nag on all you want, but do you really think insulting smokers like that is really going to make them stop? no. We have as much right to do what we want in public space just as much as you do!!
It entirely up to the shop owner if he/she wants to stand at the entrance to their shop and smoke, as i've said, if you don't like it, don't go in/near the place.
Last I heard, you are allowed to smoke on the street and it's not illegal to smell of smoke.
Smokers shouldn't need to hide away or cut back just because it suits you. If you're that unhappy with it, write to the council or the government. I'm sure this matter will be resolved almost immediately....
rogermellie
19-Aug-12, 02:25
Last I heard, you are allowed to smoke on the street and it's not illegal to smell of smoke.
Smokers shouldn't need to hide away or cut back just because it suits you. If you're that unhappy with it, write to the council or the government. I'm sure this matter will be resolved almost immediately....
let's keep things in perspective, of course you can make a stink wherever you want, just don't expect me to spend my hard earned in your shop
if the owner of a business knew that customers were put off by the lazy attitude and general pong of their employees, they'd do something about it
if your defending this just because you're a smoker, then know this .... poowhee, you stink
Tinkerbell09
19-Aug-12, 02:37
let's keep things in perspective, of course you can make a stink wherever you want, just don't expect me to spend my hard earned in your shop
Don't go in the shop then? simple! That way, you're happy not being near the stink, and they are happy not having to hear about it.
And i'm old enough to smoke, i'm old enough to know what it does to you too. I don't need to hear it from all the anti-smokers just because they simply "don't like it" And I have enough money to be smoking while doing my arts & crafts ;)
rogermellie
19-Aug-12, 02:47
fair play to you, sorry for calling you stinky, i know how hard it is to stop smoking, but i managed it after my kids literally begged me
i'm sure if you had an on/off switch for smoking, you'd switch it off, hopefully one day you and all the other stinkies will be able to do it :Razz
Tinkerbell09
19-Aug-12, 02:50
It’s been proven that 100% of people that smoke die…it’s also been proven that 100% of people that don’t smoke die too. :cool:
One day...... maybe!
you can slowly kill yourself and smell like dirt in your own space, not ours, you're the minority, why should we put up with your poisonous stink ?
As tinkerbell said, you can always cross the street. If you plan on retorting with "why should I have to cross the street just because you're smoking" then as I said, why do we need to hide away? Everyone has a right to be able to smoke, everyone has a right not to like it.
let's keep things in perspective, of course you can make a stink wherever you want, just don't expect me to spend my hard earned in your shop
If you don't want to support local businesses just because of a cigarette smell then that is disappointing, but again this is your right.[/QUOTE]
i go past this mystery shop several times a day and they're constantly outside smoking and making the street look untidy and smelly
I believe you've mistaken smokers for the large amount of litter and the general stink of the street that already resides there.
Come on people let's show a little tolerance here! Most smokers will acknowledge that their habit is a problem for them and those around them; they would give up in an instant if they could. Most smokers will avoid breathing their smoke near you and they take care of their personal hygiene because they know the residue of their habit permeates their clothing and their hair. If you're a non-smoker you can avoid the shop and buy elsewhere. If you're the shop keeper and your 'foot fall' is in decline you know what you must do to change things.
Many of us have friends and aquaintences who smoke and we can still get along fine because we're open-minded and considerate enough not to let it get in the way of our relationship.
j_1971son
19-Aug-12, 11:59
The saddest thing about this is that the shop keepers who you are on about are trying to stop smoking and you are not helping by not only going on about it, but even worse you are encouraging people to shop on-line which is taking away business. As for someone going into the shop and noting the manufacturers code, they then are obviously ok with the shop-keepers smoking otherwise they would not go in.
The best thing anyone can do if they see a smoking shopkeeper is run and get the nearest fire extinguisher and fire blanket. When you have put him out then call for the fire brigade and Ambulance.
C3................:roll:;)
Peter Sellers' younger days might provide an illuminating idea which could be adapted for shopkeepers.....
"
70 years ago, long before the days of the wireless and the cinematograph entertainment. We young lads had to make our own amusements.
Such games as stoning the lamplighter, and tripping the muffin man – provided harmless outlets for the release of our boyish energy.
But the most popular of all our escapades was undoubtedly the one called, quite simply, setting fire to the policeman.
Now this risky operation was invariably carried out at night. Since darkness made it less likely that we would be recognized, and at the same time lent dramatic emphasis to the spectacle of the flaming bobby.
There were several alternative methods and variations used in perpetrating this jape, but I will confine myself to describing the standard procedure we usually employed.
Three carefree young limbs would sally forth for the evening, each one knowing by heart what he had to do.
One lad, selected for his fleetness of foot, would be wearing plimsoles.
Another, chosen for his golden ringlets and generally angelic appearance, would be clad in a velvet suit.
Whilst the third, uh, the strongman of the party, would be carrying a packet of lucifers, and an enormous bucket which was half filled with kerosene.
The time of the rendezvous with the previously selected, but unsuspecting constable (always a man known for his good nature and his kindness to children), it was planned to the split-second. And it was so arranged that the encounter took place in the darkest portion of some ill-lit street.
On arrival at the appointed place the team would spring into action like clockwork. Pretending to blubber, you see, the velvet clad cherub would approach the officer and murmur, rather inaudibly through his sobs, that he was lost. Whereupon the worthy custodian of the law would kneel or bend down in order to make out what the pathetic infant was saying.
Now then, at this, at this precise moment, the bearer of the kerosene filled bucket would swiftly emerge from the shadows and empty the entire contents of his utensil over the pillar of the law. Then, like lightening, the Lucifer was produced, struck, run along the hem of the blue tunic and, hey presto, yet another policeman in a state of combustion. Well done lads.
Very well, there’s no time to be lost in self congratulation. The fire brigade must be summoned before the constable can sustain any serious burns. So off like the wind goes our young runner to the nearest fire station, his twinkling plimsolls barely touching the pavement as he speeds on his errand of mercy.
Before long, the exciting sound of the horse-drawn fire appliance can be heard in the distance, growing louder every second. Now this sound, unfortunately, is something that is no longer to be heard nowadays. Pity. True the bell still rings, but where is the heavy rumble of the wheels, the jingling of the harness, the crack of the whip, the clatter of the hooves, the snorting and the panting of the horses? Now they were sounds to stir the blood… gone, alas, forever. And gone with them, half the fun of the fire, but I digress.
Our policeman is by now well and truly alight. See how he lights up the dingy street for yards around? Franticly he blows his whistle and flails himself about the body with his truncheon, in a vain attempt to put out the flames. A knot of eager spectators has now gathered and many a course jibe and ribald comment will be made at the expense of the luckless limb of the law. Perhaps a wag in the crowd will cry out something like “policemen should keep cool at all times”. Or an elderly slattern reeking of intoxicants may be heard to shriek “smoking on duty, that’s what ‘e’s a doing - ought to have the law on him, that’s what.” Each sally being greeted by a general burst of merriment from the assembled bystanders. Hehehe…
The policeman’s plight would seem to be desperate, but, help is close at hand. The fire appliance draw up with great commotion and the nimble firemen leap into action. There is no time to find a hydrant and the hand pump is operated at once from the emergency barrel which is always carried. Whist his perspiring comrades pump valiantly, one brave fellow takes the hose and gets as near to the incandescent officer as the heat of the flames will allow. The flow of water is released, and the stream is directed point blank at the target.
Much too soon it’s all over. There is nothing to look at, save the charred and saturated object, scarcely recognizable as a human being lying on the pavement.
The sightseers, their holiday mood gone, begin to disperse in silence and go about their business. Sometimes before they went, one of their number would make a collection on behalf of the gallant little lad who had the presence of mind to run to the fire station. On these days it was three tired, but very happy youngsters who trudged with their golden sovereigns and half sovereigns jingling in their pockets, very pleased with their evenings work and after all, who can blame them?
All this, as I say, took place more then 70 years ago. But, even today, whenever I see a policeman I am still gripped by an almost insane desire to set fire to him."
hasterhall
19-Aug-12, 18:36
I find strong Body Odor more offensive than fag smoke. the funny thing is its normally a non smoker who stinks.and you say smokers stink of smoke,
why don't you buy a bar of soap and leave us smokers to die in peace.
cheers
rant over
cazmanian_minx
19-Aug-12, 19:01
Is it tainting the goods in the shop though? I'm an online retailer and last year I had an item returned by a customer who'd received her order, realised she'd bought the wrong thing and sent it back for a refund. It was in her house for less than 24 hours and I could smell the cigarette smoke as soon as I opened the jiffy bag. It was still in perfect condition, but had to be binned because of the smell. I doubt very much she smoked a cigarette right next to it, but just being in the same space as a smoker in that short time had rendered it unsellable.
I would have thought that if someone had a shop then they would make it as much as possible into a pleasant experience for all their customers to enter and browse around? :eek:
I would have thought that if someone had a shop then they would make it as much as possible into a pleasant experience for all their customers to enter and browse around? :eek:
They should offer the customer a fag.
It entirely up to the shop owner if he/she wants to stand at the entrance to their shop and smoke, as i've said, if you don't like it, don't go in/near the place.
And this kind of attitude right here is why shops on the high street are dying and people are electing to spend their hard-earned cash online.
Personally I choose not to enter premises if I have to walk past people smoking to enter the door, happens with restaurants and pubs too, my trade goes elsewhere.
If the trader, whatever they may be trading in, chooses to encourage people to smoke at the entrance to their premises instead of providing alternate areas for smokers, they will lose my trade as I do not wish to trigger an asthma attack and try to get the smell of smoke from my clothes and body.
I've heard this speech 101 times about slowly killing myself, and you can nag on all you want, but do you really think insulting smokers like that is really going to make them stop? no. We have as much right to do what we want in public space just as much as you do!!
It entirely up to the shop owner if he/she wants to stand at the entrance to their shop and smoke, as i've said, if you don't like it, don't go in/near the place.
Well written and so very apt!
And this kind of attitude right here is why shops on the high street are dying and people are electing to spend their hard-earned cash online.
Nonsense! people in general are spending less, it has nothing to do with whether or not another chooses to smoke.
And this kind of attitude right here is why shops on the high street are dying and people are electing to spend their hard-earned cash online.
And that kind of reply is why people like yourself will get flamed on a public forum :roll:
people are buying online because 1.) its a good bit cheaper than buying from the high street, 2.) you can browse from the comfort of your armchair with a cuppa and a cig in hand [lol] and 3.) Apart from when you use Yodel, it gets delivered to your front door within 48hrs!.
I hate the smoking thingy myself and think there is nothing worse than having to wade through a pungent cloud to enter the place but i still use shops/pubs etc which have puffers loitering outside although if there is another similar business close by i will choose to use that instead.
Even Chance
21-Aug-12, 13:00
If everybody used the web for stuff, and not the local shops they'll be gone soon.
Why flame midi2304 for this when its true.
So, for all you web-purchasers oot there. When you need an item in this remote location quickly, and theres no shop to sell it to you, just mind who it wis at caused their demise in e first place.
Keep the money in the local economy. What is it they say:- use it or lose it! So apt dont you think?
As for smoking at the shop entrance. Pah, Im a converted Asthmatic smoker mysel. Been 5 years now withoot a fag, and it disna bother me one wee bit. In fact I use the shop cos its got exactly the items I need:-LOCALLY.
Get a grip you lot....
Am i the only one here who hasn't got a clue which shop we are talking about? I personally have never been followed around or had fag smoke billow around me in any wick store on the high street? Anyone wish to PM me this information?
:roll:
Invisible
21-Aug-12, 16:39
you can slowly kill yourself
I've heard this speech 101 times about slowly killing myself,
This argument is void. Since your first breath you spend your living dying.
Simple solution to this thread is, if its bothering you so much then dont go this particular shop. Be a dooer rather than a thinker. Smoking is a choice and who are we to say if its right or wrong to do it in the door way of your business.
Am i the only one here who hasn't got a clue which shop we are talking about? I personally have never been followed around or had fag smoke billow around me in any wick store on the high street? Anyone wish to PM me this information?
:roll:
They're confused. It's the Sheriff Court. I'm certainly not answering any summons while smokers surround the door!
If the non smokers are not happy with smokers having a fag outside why dont they go round wearing a mask instead of moaning then they wont have to breathe it in they cant have it all there own way we smokers have rights to .
Nonsense! people in general are spending less, it has nothing to do with whether or not another chooses to smoke.
People are spending less. Which makes it more and more vital that shops on the high street do every single little thing they can to not put potential shoppers off from visiting them. Like smoking. Pretty simple really.
Not a smoker but I think smokers are the backbone of the nation. Despite the fact that cigs are 10 million squid a pack they keep on going paying the tax. The argument that they cost the nhs a packet in cancer treatment is a non argument, they might die of cancer true, but they do it 10 or 15 years earlier than the non smoker who is constantly back and forth to the GP with arthritis, angina etc and is'nt paying the smokers proportion of tax. The ratio of benefits is way in favour of the smoking heroes.
God bless the smoker without them the NHS would be on its knees!
P.S - Don't bother questioning these facts as I've just made them up and don't care one way or the other.
peedie man
21-Aug-12, 22:21
and look what it saves in old age pensions
Not a smoker but I think smokers are the backbone of the nation. Despite the fact that cigs are 10 million squid a pack they keep on going paying the tax. The argument that they cost the nhs a packet in cancer treatment is a non argument, they might die of cancer true, but they do it 10 or 15 years earlier than the non smoker who is constantly back and forth to the GP with arthritis, angina etc and is'nt paying the smokers proportion of tax. The ratio of benefits is way in favour of the smoking heroes.
God bless the smoker without them the NHS would be on its knees!
P.S - Don't bother questioning these facts as I've just made them up and don't care one way or the other.Well said so true if smoking cost the nhs so much money through illness why dont they ban tobbacco no they wont because it makes so much tax.
hopper.65
21-Aug-12, 23:23
let's keep things in perspective, of course you can make a stink wherever you want, just don't expect me to spend my hard earned in your shop
if the owner of a business knew that customers were put off by the lazy attitude and general pong of their employees, they'd do something about it
if your defending this just because you're a smoker, then know this .... poowhee, you stink
What a horrible way to treat anyone even if they are a smoker, who's to say i you don't have bad breath, overdone it on the garlic or any other form of odour yourself and even if you don't is that who you set upon next, too much time on your hands i say to come on here and slaughter folk for having a fag and in case you didn't know the smell of someone who smokes is not toxic to you in anyway, moan moan moan don't blame those who became addicted to something the governments of this country was completely unconcerned about and even encouraged due to huge taxes this generates and still does and before anyone says it costs more to treat ill smokers than what it takes in taxes is very much not the case and without it everyone's taxes will rise considerably so it aint all bad for you if you don't smoke as these people mean you pay considerably less tax than you would do if they didn't!
Many smokers fall victim to this menace of a drug when young and foolish so this country is failing these youngsters by not going for a full out ban but instead they know they are in big trouble without the cash this generates to be spent on schools, public amenities in general and choose not to.
It's not that long since cigarette advertising was band this was allowed knowing it was harmful to one's health and was all the time having an influence on people taking up the habit.
These people who smoke are honestly victims and the vast majority would rather not have to pay £7 a day to help end their lives sooner but are addicted to what is a very powerful drug with nasty withdrawl effects on those trying to quit so try not to turn your nose up at folk who smoke it is none of your business anyway and by taking your car around town is causing people more harm than anyone standing in open air having a smoke.
Get a grip!
I would rather be served by a smoker (who smokes outside the shop as per the law etc) than a shop assistant with a wind problem or a BO problem....and as the shops on the high st in Wick go there isnt anywhere the shopworkers can go to smoke and hide ...unlike bigger places....supermarkets etc ..hide up the back etc...where customers ncant see...
I am very glad that the law changed on smoking in public enclosed spaces like shops, restaurants and pubs. It has given everyone a real free choice, whether to smoke or not. And that is all that is really needed. While it is not pleasant to have to walk through smoke to get into a premises, it is a very very minor and momentary thing to do. What is more worrying is that small businesses struggle every day. They are fighting against larger homogenising companies. If we do not support local businesses we will loose them. Managing a shop like this is alot of hard work, is very expensive and involves making alot of sacrifices. We are very lucky to have a shop like this in our vicinity. If we do not use them we will loose them. And on line ordering for some things, such as colour matching or learning a new technique by seeing someone do it, is no subsitute.
If we do not use them we will loose them. And on line ordering for some things, such as colour matching or learning a new technique by seeing someone do it, is no subsitute.
I am unsure why we should support sub-standard practises in local shops simply to keep them open. I am from Caithness but have only recently moved back to the area after six years in Aberdeen. Shops in Aberdeen would never get away with some of the things I have seen in Thurso and Wick. Yes, I want a healthy high street in Wick and Thurso but should I be expected to accept a lower standard of service just to get that? Of course not. And whether you like it or not, there are now significantly more non-smokers than smokers in Britain and whilst those of you who do smoke are more than welcome to do so, those of us who don't are more than welcome to simply not like it and spend their cash elsewhere.
On a side note, another practice I have seen happening in Thurso and Wick still which beggars belief is that of shops closing at lunch time. It blows my mind that in 2012, the people of Caithness tolerate that shops on the high street just close for an hour in the middle of the day. And any arguments that these people have to eat is nonsense - I am certainly infinitely less offended at the thought of someone in a shop munching on a sandwhich during lunch hours when I visit as opposed to simply shutting the shop altogether.
The arguments that we need to use it or lose it are moot - Thurso and Wick high streets are in a substantially poorer state than they were when I left Caithness six years ago in terms of shopping. The 'lose it' process is already happening. Shopkeepers have two options - either shut up shop which the likes of Gunns the shoe-shop is doing (although the Groat is reporting that another shop is immediately ready to take over those premises) or offer a service second to none which people actively enjoy and want. This means not being forced to tolerate smoke, strange opening hours, closing at lunch time and a suite of other things. 'Use it or lose it' appears to be a cop-out for Caithness shops to operate in a less professional fashion than those elsewhere and I don't see why that kind of attitude should be tolerated.
a shop assistant with a wind problem ...
Name and shame! Where is this disgusting town centre shop where they fart at the till? Are they incomers?
You don't have a shop do you Dadie? I seem to remember another thread......
Tinkerbell09
23-Aug-12, 21:51
And this kind of attitude right here is why shops on the high street are dying and people are electing to spend their hard-earned cash online.
And this kind of attitude is the reason why shops are shutting, because the community pick appart every shop's faults then fail to support them.
And this kind of attitude is the reason why shops are shutting, because the community pick appart every shop's faults then fail to support them.
Ah ok, you chose to ignore my post four posts above this one where I gave a very detailed explanation of why your comment here is nonsense.
I have never had a shop...I dont have the time...I have children undeer school age and childcare is expensive...:eek:
And I have always thought the washing powder/cat food aisle in tescos smells bad!
Not sure if its the drains or if there is another problem.....
Or if another shopper has let one go and walked off or the stacker is the culprit!
And this kind of attitude is the reason why shops are shutting, because the community pick appart every shop's faults then fail to support them.
No.
Shops are shutting because people are using their free will not to use them.
"Support" for local shops is one thing. Charity, and having your eyes ripped out of your head for substandard service and goods in an uninviting, inconvenient situation, is another.
secrets in symmetry
23-Aug-12, 23:51
I am unsure why we should support sub-standard practises in local shops simply to keep them open. I am from Caithness but have only recently moved back to the area after six years in Aberdeen. Shops in Aberdeen would never get away with some of the things I have seen in Thurso and Wick. Yes, I want a healthy high street in Wick and Thurso but should I be expected to accept a lower standard of service just to get that? Of course not. And whether you like it or not, there are now significantly more non-smokers than smokers in Britain and whilst those of you who do smoke are more than welcome to do so, those of us who don't are more than welcome to simply not like it and spend their cash elsewhere.
On a side note, another practice I have seen happening in Thurso and Wick still which beggars belief is that of shops closing at lunch time. It blows my mind that in 2012, the people of Caithness tolerate that shops on the high street just close for an hour in the middle of the day. And any arguments that these people have to eat is nonsense - I am certainly infinitely less offended at the thought of someone in a shop munching on a sandwhich during lunch hours when I visit as opposed to simply shutting the shop altogether.
The arguments that we need to use it or lose it are moot - Thurso and Wick high streets are in a substantially poorer state than they were when I left Caithness six years ago in terms of shopping. The 'lose it' process is already happening. Shopkeepers have two options - either shut up shop which the likes of Gunns the shoe-shop is doing (although the Groat is reporting that another shop is immediately ready to take over those premises) or offer a service second to none which people actively enjoy and want. This means not being forced to tolerate smoke, strange opening hours, closing at lunch time and a suite of other things. 'Use it or lose it' appears to be a cop-out for Caithness shops to operate in a less professional fashion than those elsewhere and I don't see why that kind of attitude should be tolerated.I won't ignore your post. I laud your patient exposition. :cool:
I hope some of the shop owners who smoke at their doorways and close at lunchtime take note of the points you raise - for the sake of their businesses.
Tinkerbell09
24-Aug-12, 16:02
I am unsure why we should support sub-standard practises in local shops simply to keep them open. I am from Caithness but have only recently moved back to the area after six years in Aberdeen. Shops in Aberdeen would never get away with some of the things I have seen in Thurso and Wick. Yes, I want a healthy high street in Wick and Thurso but should I be expected to accept a lower standard of service just to get that? Of course not. And whether you like it or not, there are now significantly more non-smokers than smokers in Britain and whilst those of you who do smoke are more than welcome to do so, those of us who don't are more than welcome to simply not like it and spend their cash elsewhere.
On a side note, another practice I have seen happening in Thurso and Wick still which beggars belief is that of shops closing at lunch time. It blows my mind that in 2012, the people of Caithness tolerate that shops on the high street just close for an hour in the middle of the day. And any arguments that these people have to eat is nonsense - I am certainly infinitely less offended at the thought of someone in a shop munching on a sandwhich during lunch hours when I visit as opposed to simply shutting the shop altogether.
The arguments that we need to use it or lose it are moot - Thurso and Wick high streets are in a substantially poorer state than they were when I left Caithness six years ago in terms of shopping. The 'lose it' process is already happening. Shopkeepers have two options - either shut up shop which the likes of Gunns the shoe-shop is doing (although the Groat is reporting that another shop is immediately ready to take over those premises) or offer a service second to none which people actively enjoy and want. This means not being forced to tolerate smoke, strange opening hours, closing at lunch time and a suite of other things. 'Use it or lose it' appears to be a cop-out for Caithness shops to operate in a less professional fashion than those elsewhere and I don't see why that kind of attitude should be tolerated.
If Caithness is in that much of a poor state than you remember, why don't you do something about it and talk to the Highland Council ?
"This means not being forced to tolerate smoke" Smokers have the right to smoke in public if they wish! We don't FORCE you to walk through our clouds, that's up to you if you walk passed/through it or not, but no-one is forcing you to walk through it!
What's wrong with the whole shop's situation IS a case of "use it, or lose it" in my own opinion. Lets take the Thurso Cinema for instance. When it was The All Star Factory, the public complained that it was too expensive to go, then it shut down because no-one was using it. THEN the public were complaining that it had shut down and they had to drive 200+ miles just to get to the cinema and back. I think many people would aggree it is a case of "Use it or lose it"
And people do need to eat to stay alive to keep the shop open, so people don't complain that it's shut completely ;)
If Caithness is in that much of a poor state than you remember, why don't you do something about it and talk to the Highland Council ? "This means not being forced to tolerate smoke" Smokers have the right to smoke in public if they wish! We don't FORCE you to walk through our clouds, that's up to you if you walk passed/through it or not, but no-one is forcing you to walk through it! What's wrong with the whole shop's situation IS a case of "use it, or lose it" in my own opinion. Lets take the Thurso Cinema for instance. When it was The All Star Factory, the public complained that it was too expensive to go, then it shut down because no-one was using it. THEN the public were complaining that it had shut down and they had to drive 200+ miles just to get to the cinema and back. I think many people would aggree it is a case of "Use it or lose it" And people do need to eat to stay alive to keep the shop open, so people don't complain that it's shut completely ;)
Your example is perfect. The All Star Factory closed because they offered a poor service. It was too expensive and films were shown weeks after mainstream release dates. The public voted with their feet and because people actively chose not to accept bad service it was closed. One of the key points of the campaign to have it reopened was that if someone was going to do it, it had to be a substantially better service than whatt was offered previously and having went myself last Friday evening I can tell you that it is cheaper, cleaner and I got to see a movie that launched nationwide the day before.
Tl;dr: Your example proves why what you are saying is nonsense so thanks for that.
Now to address the smoking thing. Go to any shop on the high street in any city in Scotland. Any one. Go on. Tell me if you find the staff smoking at or anywhere near any single retail premises. You won't. Do you know why? Because it is considered discourteous to the non-smokers who make up the vast majority of the population. Realising the threat of online shopping they are doing all they can to offer good service.
As for the food comment well I don't even know where to start seeing as you quite clearly didn't read what I wrote. Far better that a shop remains open while the staff have a pie or a sandwich at the counter than to shut at a time which tends to be the most convenient for potential customers. Simple common sense.
Tinkerbell, you are the perfect example of someone on a forum who should take a few extra minutes very carefully thinking and reading others on a forum, particularly those who reply directly to you, before posting in a thread. There is a very famous quotation I could use right here but I won't.
Heard that in Thurso as well as Gunns and 99p shop shutting so is Hush, Picture Box and Whatsits, shame.
Gunns has explained why he was closing in the journal and the 99p shop has been shut for a few months now. Dont think Whatsits is closing as they have just recently moved into 2 new shops, whatsits 1 and whatsits 2. they split the tools etc into one shop and the cards & gifts etc into the other and as for the other two businesses i have no idea but suffice to say unless you know exactly what the situation is, then best not to say anything on a public forum incase people take it as written and do think the shops are closed thus causing more difficulties than any cloud of smoke outside the front door would.
Well actually the 99p shop was still open today so I think you better take a leaf out of your own book, and there is no whatsits1 and 2 in Thurso.
secrets in symmetry
24-Aug-12, 23:33
Tinkerbell, you are the perfect example of someone on a forum who should take a few extra minutes very carefully thinking and reading others on a forum, particularly those who reply directly to you, before posting in a thread. There is a very famous quotation I could use right here but I won't.Oh go on, use the quotation. :cool:
i really dont know why i bother replying on this forum, i simply thought you meant Wick and not Thurso. Since you are so snappy with your comebacks instead of asking if i had made a mistake maybe you shouldn't bother replying instead. Oh and dont bother with another snippy snidey comment to this as i wont be bothering anymore with the forums.
Tinkerbell09
26-Aug-12, 18:37
Your example is perfect. The All Star Factory closed because they offered a poor service. It was too expensive and films were shown weeks after mainstream release dates. The public voted with their feet and because people actively chose not to accept bad service it was closed. One of the key points of the campaign to have it reopened was that if someone was going to do it, it had to be a substantially better service than whatt was offered previously and having went myself last Friday evening I can tell you that it is cheaper, cleaner and I got to see a movie that launched nationwide the day before.
Tl;dr: Your example proves why what you are saying is nonsense so thanks for that.
Now to address the smoking thing. Go to any shop on the high street in any city in Scotland. Any one. Go on. Tell me if you find the staff smoking at or anywhere near any single retail premises. You won't. Do you know why? Because it is considered discourteous to the non-smokers who make up the vast majority of the population. Realising the threat of online shopping they are doing all they can to offer good service.
As for the food comment well I don't even know where to start seeing as you quite clearly didn't read what I wrote. Far better that a shop remains open while the staff have a pie or a sandwich at the counter than to shut at a time which tends to be the most convenient for potential customers. Simple common sense.
Tinkerbell, you are the perfect example of someone on a forum who should take a few extra minutes very carefully thinking and reading others on a forum, particularly those who reply directly to you, before posting in a thread. There is a very famous quotation I could use right here but I won't.
As the majority of threads on Caithness.org usually end up in arguments these days, I ALWAYS end up saying EVERYONE is entitled to their own opinions. I'm just putting mine across, and I respect others opnions too.
Midi, you are the perfect example of someone who ought to respect other's views aswell as you're own. I will post as I wish. This thread mearly started as a dicussion, and ended as an argument.
There is a very horrible word I could put here right now, but I wont ;)
As the majority of threads on Caithness.org usually end up in arguments these days, I ALWAYS end up saying EVERYONE is entitled to their own opinions. I'm just putting mine across, and I respect others opnions too.
Midi, you are the perfect example of someone who ought to respect other's views aswell as you're own. I will post as I wish. This thread mearly started as a dicussion, and ended as an argument.
There is a very horrible word I could put here right now, but I wont ;)
Tinkerbell I very specifically did not say not to post. What I said was you should think before you do. For example, when you post something arguing someone else's point and inadvertently prove them correct, that makes you look rather silly. It is very difficult to respect someone's opinion when they prove you correct and contradict themselves. Still, I am glad you have now moved away from discussing any of my points regarding this thread and have regressed to personal attacks. You are, as always, free to post as you wish. But people are also free to interpret your posts as they see fit. That's how these things work.
PS - Capitals, italics and bold is probably a little too much emphasis.
secrets in symmetry
26-Aug-12, 19:37
I'm with Tinkerbell today - there's nothing wrong with having a fly fag and a quick swally when you shut the shop doors for lunch. :cool:
http://i.imgur.com/tJR8Z.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/tJR8Z.jpgShe's smokin' hot!!!!
telfordstar
27-Aug-12, 21:11
well you'd honestly think the world was going to end on here because shopkeepers have a puff outside. moan when they cant smoke indoors and moan when the do it outside. I'm guessing the smoke dosnt go into the shop onto stock so where's the problem. if they need a break so be it! if they had to go elsewhere to have one and close the shop forv5-10mins that would be a fault! what a bunch of moaning s are on here. maybe getting a life would help!
well you'd honestly think the world was going to end on here because shopkeepers have a puff outside. moan when they cant smoke indoors and moan when the do it outside. I'm guessing the smoke dosnt go into the shop onto stock so where's the problem. if they need a break so be it! if they had to go elsewhere to have one and close the shop forv5-10mins that would be a fault! what a bunch of moaning s are on here. maybe getting a life would help!
No I don't think the world is going to end. But I do not like the fumes and smell so I will choose to shop elsewhere. Simple.
And I think the fact that so many people knew exactly which shop out of the whole county the OP was talking about, even before what kind of stuff they sell was mentioned (I have multiple pms confirming this), shows that it may just be putting customers off a little bit. That is up to them to fix if they choose to. Further than that I do not care.
As long as the things being sold are not tainted with smoke, and, the till operators can manage the till when needed whats the problem?
Is it because they are being seen smoking....as there isnt anywhere else they can go, or is it a vendetta?
I dont condone smoking near premises or feel the urge to discourage the act...but would it be worse to smoke across the street and cross when someone goes into the shop?
secrets in symmetry
27-Aug-12, 23:22
She's smokin' hot!!!!Indeed....
She's fragrant and classy too, with such elegance in her poise (and in her elocution) that her potential clients won't be able to resist the charms she has for sale in her retail premises. What's more, there's plenty more where that came from. We're famous for our generosity in Week. :cool:
heck...dont encourage me in what Wick needs shop wise or I might be tempted to fill the gap.....though I would need funding etc....
A good suck you in bra / body shop...
jean shop that doesnt need you to see all of your underwear/what can be on offer...
any other suggestions?
secrets in symmetry
27-Aug-12, 23:39
How can you fill a big gap, Dadie? You're such a skinny thing. :cool:
You don't smoke either, so how are you going to get free negative publicity on your local forum?
The second post on this thread should have been from the owners of the shop saying that they were sorry that their smoking habits had upset so many customers and potential customers, and that they would rectify the situation immediately. It's a “no brainer” for everyone to be standing on their principles and justifying the rights to smoke when every customer is so important to the success of a small business. How serious they are about this success, depends on the sacrifices they are willing to make. Now that this little problem has been identified, it should leave the owners in no doubt which way to turn now. The customer may not always be right but they are paying your wages.
The second post on this thread should have been from the owners of the shop saying that they were sorry that their smoking habits had upset so many customers and potential customers, and that they would rectify the situation immediately. It's a “no brainer” for everyone to be standing on their principles and justifying the rights to smoke when every customer is so important to the success of a small business. How serious they are about this success, depends on the sacrifices they are willing to make. Now that this little problem has been identified, it should leave the owners in no doubt which way to turn now. The customer may not always be right but they are paying your wages.
This. A thousand times this.
The debate in this forum is whether people should be allowed to smoke around shops or not and that those of us who don't smoke shouldn't stop those who wish to, yadda, yadda, yadda. Whether the non-smokers are 'right' or 'wrong' is moot. It is absolutely irrelevant. If a large number of potential customers went onto this forum and said 'the colour of that wall in the shop is really disgusting. They should paint it orange instead', what I would next expect to happen is for that shopowner to buy a pot of orange paint and change it. It may not be reasonable, it may not even be 'fair' but these are the people putting money in your tills to keep your store afloat and a pot of orange paint doesn't cost much. Stopping staff smoking in and around your shop costs even less.
As I said before, go to any city high street in Scotland and see how many staff you see smoking outside of shop premises there. Doesn't happen.
Smokers, you need to stop thinking about this in terms of 'I should be allowed to smoke here' and start thinking along the lines of 'I should be welcoming as many people in as possible to spend money to pay my wages'. This is pretty simple economics. Your right to smoke is not in question.
KEEP_ON_TRUCKIN
28-Aug-12, 13:22
As a "shopkeeper" you live in fear of coming on these boards and seeing negative things about your business - and if you do I agree with Midi you want to act sensibly and quickly - not that i'm indicating that I think the shopkeepers in question in this thread should act in any other way than they see fit.
From a personal point of view the Org and facebook etc are a critical tool in promoting your business and taking opportunity to right any wrongs - actual or perceived!
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