View Full Version : Suicide rate 80% higher in Scotland. Particularly among adult men.
I'm assuming everyone saw or heard about this (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-16950313) today. Just wondering if there were any comments on it?
I haven't read about it today but I remember a couple of years ago that the Highlands and Islands were the places where most suicides took place. Still not sure about why this is so, perhaps its the isolation, the lack of employment, I just don't know but what I do know is that no MP or MSP has tackled this problem and it seems nothing has altered in the last few years.
Personally I think it's a lot to do with depression, it can be very depressing for some living up here.
Sorry, I don't want to comment any further.
C3............:(:(
annemarie482
09-Feb-12, 21:14
not sure this thread is entirely appropriate considering todays news :confused
Perhaps the average Scots male is a bit more savy than their English counterpart & are more likely to figure out the truth that life is pointless, thus deciding that since it is pointless then why bother carrying on.
not sure this thread is entirely appropriate considering todays news :confused
Completely forgot about that.
I haven't read about it today but I remember a couple of years ago that the Highlands and Islands were the places where most suicides took place. Still not sure about why this is so, perhaps its the isolation, the lack of employment, I just don't know but what I do know is that no MP or MSP has tackled this problem and it seems nothing has altered in the last few years.
Personally I think it's a lot to do with depression, it can be very depressing for some living up here.
Sorry, I don't want to comment any further.
C3............:(:(
There's that though I was wondering about the gender divide more than anything, females rates have stayed about the same since 1960. This study only counts successful attempts BTW. Historically women make more attempts but are less successful, they tend to use it as a cry for help.
[QUOTE=annemarie482;927498]not sure this thread is entirely appropriate considering todays news :confused I completely agree with anne marie perhaps this should not be on here todayI
oldmarine
09-Feb-12, 23:13
No one asked me about it. I question the validity of the whole thing.
Mystical Potato Head
10-Feb-12, 00:11
Why would anybody ask you about it? And the validity of what, are you questioning? This is a study that has been carried out over a number of years. They have not just plucked the figures out of mid air or made them up, what on earth would be the point of that? It is bad enough when a member of your family dies due to ill health, but when a member of your family takes their own life, it is just unbearable.
Unfortunately i can relate to that first hand,it most certainly is unbearable.I took me a few years to come to terms with it and be able to handle it,you never get over it though and people who make comments about them being selfish for not thinking about those they leave behind have obviously not gone through it themselves.People who suffer from severe depression cant possibly be thinking straight when their last resort is to take their own life and there is a very tiny grain of comfort to be gained from that belief.If they felt their life was so bad then the suffering is over for them.
Unfortunately i can relate to that first hand,it most certainly is unbearable.I took me a few years to come to terms with it and be able to handle it,you never get over it though and people who make comments about them being selfish for not thinking about those they leave behind have obviously not gone through it themselves.People who suffer from severe depression cant possibly be thinking straight when their last resort is to take their own life and there is a very tiny grain of comfort to be gained from that belief.If they felt their life was so bad then the suffering is over for them.
I have to agree with your statement. They cannot be thinking straight. Infact, they must be out of their minds. I say this with no malice, but who of us in the right frame of mind, would take our own lives. They must be tormented, for what ever reason.
demac-artist
10-Feb-12, 01:19
Actually i dont agree with
not sure this thread is entirely appropriate considering todays news
people need to stop discussing suicide as a taboo.
Depression is a major life affecting condition, that affects every aspect of your life, perspective is unbalanced in relationships, work or lack of, money, the way you think and feel. They need support, understanding and someone who listens. You probably know someone who has depression but they hide it very well look at the list below and increase your awareness and be less critical.
Deanne
http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/diseases/facts/depression.htm
In addition to feeling low most or all of the time, many other symptoms can occur in depressive illness (though not everybody has every one).
Being unable to gain pleasure from activities that normally would be pleasurable.
Losing interest in normal activities, hobbies and everyday life.
Feeling tired all of the time and having no energy.
Difficulty sleeping or waking early in the morning (though some feel that they can't get out of bed and 'face the world').
Having a poor appetite, no interest in food and losing weight (though some people overeat and put on weight – 'comfort eating').
Losing interest in sex.
Finding it difficult to concentrate and think straight.
Feeling restless, tense and anxious (http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/diseases/depression/anxietydisorders_000017.htm).
Being irritable.
Losing self-confidence.
Avoiding other people.
Finding it harder than usual to make decisions.
Feeling useless and inadequate – 'a waste of space'.
Feeling guilty about who you are and what you have done.
Feeling hopeless – that nothing will make things better.
Thinking about suicide (http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/diseases/facts/suicide.htm) – this is very common. If you feel this way, talk to somebody about it. If you think somebody else might be thinking this way, ask them about it – it will not make them more likely to commit suicide.
What to do if you are depressed
Talk to people about how you feel. Don't bottle things up. It is NOT a sign of weakness to get help for your problems, in the same way that it would not be to get medical help for a broken leg or a chest infection.
Although you may not be able to do the things you normally would (such as work), try to keep active as much as you can. Lying in bed or sitting thinking about your problems can make them seem worse. Physical exercise (http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/sports/index.shtml) can also help depression and keep your mind off your worries.
Do not increase your alcohol (http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/diseases/depression/alcoholanddepression_000486.htm) intake to try and 'drown your sorrows' or help you sleep better. Alcohol will only make the depression worse and harder to treat.
If you are having problems sleeping, try not to lie in bed thinking about your problems and anxieties. Do something to take your mind off your worries, such as reading or listening to the radio.
Self-help books may be helpful. Check out the health section of any good bookshop.
If you are feeling suicidal (http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/diseases/facts/suicide.htm) or desperate contact a voluntary sector organisation, such as the Samaritans (http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/depression/support_groups/006224.htm).
Always remember that you are suffering from an illness. It is not you being weak, and you can NOT simply 'pull yourself together'. Your illness is treatable. You are also NOT ALONE. Depression is extremely common.
maybe its worth posting this
Samaritans 08457 90 90 90 - if you are struggling then pick up the phone and call them - there is always someone to listen without judging.
I'm really hoping someone else tackles the gender disparity. I've got my own ideas but don't want to influence the discussion until others say something.
The gender disparity may be due to the fact that women usually talk more to each other and frequently talk their problems over with pals, be it face to face or or the phone.
Generally men are more reluctant to talk about their problems or what is disturbing them, often feeling weak and inadequate when they are unable to deal with their problems or emotions, will cover their emotions and lack of control by over drinking or other masking behaviour.
If males would realise it is not being cissy to talk or seek help of any kind for whatever reason, often problems once uttered do not seem as big as they did before talking about them.
Help is there if you seek a listening ear or help of many types - you have to let someone know in the first place, people are not mind readers and need some help to help in the first place.
oldmarine
10-Feb-12, 23:02
I'm assuming everyone saw or heard about this (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-16950313) today. Just wondering if there were any comments on it?
I've made 3 trips to Scotland - the first two to the Naval Station to engineer and install a Satellite communications terminal. The 3rd time I traveled with my family on a tour of England & Scotland. I enjoyed Scotland and its citizens each time I was there. I was very much impressed with the highlands. I don't understand why the suicide rate should be so high in Scotland.
There is help out there, don't be afraid to seek it or suggest it to someone you know really needs help.
I too have suffered with depression which consumed me as a result of some awful things happening in my life. Its really hard to explain this but hey ho ill try, What i find is that the deperession is always nearby I dont see it on a day to day basis - it is out of my line of sight and i dont even think about it but see if things are painful, difficult or sad it creeps forward and I have to work hard not to look at it. If i turned to look at it, it would have me, swallow me up even though my life is happy and fulfilled. That may seem a contradiction but as an example - a few years ago I had a miscarriage - my second in a row. I was devastated by this and despite my life being happy and being loved and in love I was truly in danger of being swallowed up by depression - It had started to tap me on the shoulder and I almost looked at it. My husband fortunately spotted this and intervened at just the right point when I hadnt given in. I was able to look away and it passed.
Some people cant do that and sometimes even though our lives are good there are some deep dark places that even we dont recognise but which can stain even the happiest lives.
Suicide is a terrible thing but people who are suicidal often believe ABSOLUTELY and COMPLETELY that the ones they love will be better off without them. They may recognise that their loved ones will be sad at their passing but they truly believe the sadness will pass and their loved ones will agree they are better off without them.There is nothing selfish or cruel about wanting to make life better for those you love. Others are in so much pain from something; loss, grief, betrayal, shame, mental illness, that they can see no other way of making that pain stop - every day is agony and they are lost in that agony and are unable to appreciate the effect their death will have on others.
Its complex and terribly terribly terribly sad
demac-artist
11-Feb-12, 13:18
Thank you for speaking up joxville and squidge about your experiences, hope this helps someone in knowing that they are not alone in this and to recognise the signs before they feel they need to make an absolute decision that is irreversible.
Big hugs wo whoever needs one right now
Deanne
Mrs Bucket
11-Feb-12, 20:10
Thank you very much for sharing your experineces I can pass this on to someone who is suffering in a bad place right now Im sure reading this will be helpful thank you if only people would speak about it openly it woudl make such a difference to friends and family too.
secrets in symmetry
11-Feb-12, 20:27
Can I echo Mrs Bucket's post?
Joxville and squidge, I admire your courage and your openness, and I wish you future health and happiness.
I've made 3 trips to Scotland - the first two to the Naval Station to engineer and install a Satellite communications terminal. The 3rd time I traveled with my family on a tour of England & Scotland. I enjoyed Scotland and its citizens each time I was there. I was very much impressed with the highlands. I don't understand why the suicide rate should be so high in Scotland.
Visiting and living here are two different things Oldmarine.
If you are living here with no work, isolation and no hope then depression kicks in. Having said that we do have some wonderful people who can help, I can vouch for that!!
C3.........:~(
billmoseley
11-Feb-12, 20:52
if nothing else it has got people admitting and talking about depression which is a great thing.i too was in a dark place 10 years ago but managed to get help and talked to someone about my problems. talking is the best remedy and now if i feel down i talk to the wife who is wonderful listens and then seems to be able to put things in perspective.
If you believe in a heaven, then you have to believe in a hell! If you believe in neither then there is no need to fear death. If you believe your life is pointless, then there is no reason to live. Loved ones are not an issue as you have already reasoned them to be of no importance. Now if you fear death, then life must have a meaning/reason. If life has a meaning/reason, you have to make a choice of whether you want to know what that meaning/reason is. Time is ticking and death is inevitable...
Life is a diamond with many different facets... try looking at more than one!
Angel...
No apologies folks - Im doing this again because this thread is on page 2 and things are always worse at night. If you are struggling you can call samaritans on 08457 90 90 90. You will find someone who will give you the time you need to talk about your feelings without being judged.
mmmm.i could not think of a better place to live!!people in third world places should be depressed not people in the highlands.we all go through bad times!!
i have read that it is somthing to do with lack of uv this far north
As quoted by Angel "If you believe in neither then there is no need to fear death". I am a non believer and the thought of dying has scared me more than anything since i have been wee. If you believe in an existence after this one then i would say that you have less need to fear death not the other way around. Existence in any form must be better than nothing at all no?
One thing I have found is that up here a friendly "hello" is also accompanied by "how are you?". It's lovely, but you get into the habit of saying "fine" even when things aren't. People don't want to hear when they ask that actually i'm pretty poo right now... It's almost like you try and convince everyone else, and then yourself, that things are OK, but then one day the pretense gets too much and you break down. Some just cry, others take their own lives :(So next time you see someone on the street and say "Hello, how are you?", ask yourself, are they just putting on a brave face?
OK... So... Why a lower suicide rate amongst the female of the species compared to the male?
Here's my theory....
Soap Operas.... Yes... Soap Operas....
& here's why...
It's a well known fact that the female of the species is far more likely to watch them than the male of the species ia...
Picture the scene... a female & male, both thinking life is worthless & wanting it to end...
The male thinks to himself... "Life is pointless, there is nothing to live for, might as well end it all now".... & he does.
The female thinks to herself... "Life is pointless, there is nothing to live for, might as well end it all now... but... I really want to know what happens next on (insert soap opera of choice)... ach it can wait until tomorrow" then since there is never any final conclusion to a soap opera this thought pattern can repeat indefinitely until such a time as life improves.
So... in conclusion... the best therapy for suicidal thoughts is to get the person in question addicted to soap operas.
Yes... I know there is no scientific data to back this hypothesis but I feel that that is only because the research has never actually be done, about time it was.
zarapopet
12-Feb-12, 17:51
i also have been in this realy dark place . i realy hated life ,everything was ok ploding along then all of a sudden something in my passed brought me hurendeous pain. i came out about a secret i had been hiding for so many years , i thought ok now ill get the help i need to resolve this,but oh no it was even worse than i thought people making judgment ,family members disowning one ,how could they .so much for them beleiving me i was the innocent child .they took this eveil persons side,i know what they did i had to live with it being scared all the time being told id go to prison given away for being naughty running away where was my help .i came out to protect others but the strain of doing this took me so deep into this black hole. i did attempt suicide and when taken to hosp and i survived i was totaly devistated i wanted no more pain no more suffering to be at peace.
i got help i suppose most days im just ploding along but there is always this thing that creeps up like a dark shadow waiting to pounce on any point of weekness im having so it is a constat battle to keep livin. you dont think of the others being left behind you just want the suffering to stop and be at peace.stop ur brain constantly ticking terrible thoughts.
my cousin comitted suicide a few years ago and i used to say why did you take her and not me .
i also know of a few people whom have commited suiside and as they said they couldnt climb back out of their dark tunnel.
i have to live for the moment hour by hour day by day its hard work but i think im getting some where.
OK... So... Why a lower suicide rate amongst the female of the species compared to the male?Here's my theory....Soap Operas.... Yes... Soap Operas.....They actually recon there is some truth in this! There is always someone in the soaps going through some drama or another that when it happens in real life, people already have the skills to deal with it...
They actually recon there is some truth in this! There is always someone in the soaps going through some drama or another that when it happens in real life, people already have the skills to deal with it...
Very good point there....
http://fc02.deviantart.com/fs23/f/2008/021/9/d/devil_ok_by_Scotsgirl_606.gif
zarapopet
12-Feb-12, 19:40
skills to deal with it .if u are at ur most utter low and in a very bad place mentaly all your life skills go right out the window all thats on your mind is to escape this sick world and thats when so many people comit suicide. soaps are only trying to help you realise you have another choice to get help speak to someone befor its to late,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
For anyone who is suffering...please see your GP and ask if you can get a meeting with Audrey O'Brien who works out of Dunbar hospital. Audrey specialises in CBT and is absolutely brilliant.
C3...............:)
Sometime ago I woke up with no hearing, sight or speech after a brain hemorrhage. Unable to move and strapped to a bed with only water which was given on a routine basis I was making decisions as to how I could end my life with the extremely limited facilities at my disposal I formulated a plan. This took days of using the remaining senses pushing them to the limit. Little did I know that all this brain activity was actually helping my brain recover. The mumblings I heard with the black turning to varying greys helped me fine tune the plan for my own demise. Some time later I would speak some garbled rubbish which made sense to me, but plainly not to the doctors... I did not wish to be like this forever and would not wish to put my family through the torment of caring for a cabbage, me. This was an existence, not a life. Should some kind of miracle happen and I gained the facility to get to the drugs cabinet or the fire escape I would end this misery... I was determined and it was that determination that was my recovery to a normal life... Not really sure why I am saying all this but I know what it's like to want to die. I do not fear death either. It's the dying bit that frightening!
Sorry for the ramblings...
Angel...
billmoseley
13-Feb-12, 19:32
it has come as no surprise to me the number of people that have come out with stories of their own depression stories on here. we are not alone in this terrible illness. it's a pity we haven't got a group on here to share our thoughts i know if any of you on here contacted me for a chat any time i would be only too please to listen and chat with them
zarapopet
14-Feb-12, 11:05
hi i go to the haven and stepping stones it is a drop in center, the first time i went there i didnt think it was for me as it takes a wee while to get used to it and all the stangers. but hay ho i now go most days just to get out of the house and need of company ,they have gym aquipment, they do all sorts of crafts,play caerds ,pool or if u just want to sit and do nothin thats up to you. i do not know what all the users suffer from it is up to you if you want to disclose this .
The staff are also there if you need someone to talk to in privete.
so why dont you come and have a look..
my name is karen .if you dont want to go in by ur own im willing to meet you and introduce you to everyone,
Thanks zarapoppet for the information and for the offer to help anyone to go along to this venue.
Great to have a place where everyone is accepted and no questions asked, talk when you feel able or want to talk and great staff too.
I know this reply is a few days late but i must agree with DEMARK-ARTIST suicide must be talked about as must,depression,self harm, and all other mental health illness.By not talking about suicide we give the impression feeling suicidal is some thing to be ashamed of when its not.Please lets get rid of the stigma of suicide and encourage men to talk about their feelings and as importantly as talking is for us to lisen when some one has the courage to speak out.
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