View Full Version : Are we stupid
Why is Briton, giving billions in aid, to India. When they can afford to pay the French 13billion for jets.
Here are a couple of links to the story.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2094610/France-swoops-rob-UK-13bn-Indian-jet-contract.html
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-24032676-french-firm-beats-uk-to-multi-billion-pound-jet-contract.do
billmoseley
02-Feb-12, 20:32
that's easy cos we are a soft touch and would rather give our money rather than help those nearer home that really need it.
that's easy cos we are a soft touch and would rather give our money rather than help those nearer home that really need it.
It makes my blood boil.
tonkatojo
02-Feb-12, 20:52
It is an oddity why are they not supporting their own population, we are required to give them aid so they can purchase 13 billion quids worth from France, not very sporting but it says screw as much as possible from the old Raj to me.
Yes we are bliddy stupid, an' we've bin shafted royally.
The idea of the 'aid' to a nuclear space racing India is so that they buy weapo.... aircraft from BAE systems thus helping UK industry.
Instead they buy Frenchy flying 2CVs!
:confused
It does seem odd that according to Forbes Magazine India has more billionaires than the UK, and was itself able to be a foreign aid donor, providing more than £300m to poorer countries in 2008.
And "Given that the Indian government has debated whether it wants to continue receiving UK aid, the final word on the matter may not come from British shores."!
Who ever does it. It wants stopping now.
..... India has more billionaires than the UKTo be fair Beks, if I up sticks and cash in from the UK I'd be a multi millionaire in India. Even minimum wage is millionaire status in India.
To be fair Beks, if I up sticks and cash in from the UK I'd be a multi millionaire in India. Even minimum wage is millionaire status in India.
Very witty...
Interesting link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_the_number_of_US_dollar_billi onaires
Think I might go the Post Office later and get £70 worth of Indonisian Rupiah's, give me the feel good factor for the weekend!!
:Razz
The problem is that the money is paid directly to the government and some of them are massively corrupt; Very little gets to the people on the ground. Some of the countries we give money to like India and Pakistan could easily raise the same amount if they raise the tax level on their extremely wealthy (defined on a global scale not just locally). It's practically nothing right now.
The problem is that the money is paid directly to the government and some of them are massively corrupt; Very little gets to the people on the ground. Some of the countries we give money to like India and Pakistan could easily raise the same amount if they raise the tax level on their extremely wealthy (defined on a global scale not just locally). It's practically nothing right now.
If the ordinary man in the street, knows this. The why do the people, supposedly, in power, do this.
tonkatojo
03-Feb-12, 10:16
If the ordinary man in the street, knows this. The why do the people, supposedly, in power, do this.
Watching "question time" last night the only conclusion I can make is the feel good factor of the minister responsible and carrying on tradition to make the government of the day look good to the "lesser" nations, but India should not be in that category.
If the ordinary man in the street, knows this. The why do the people, supposedly, in power, do this.
My guess is that it's either a status symbol or a bribe to stop the country doing something. Britain is either the country level equivalent of someone who thinks they're a 'big man' throwing around money they don't have and displaying largess or we're bribing the country to stop them doing something that could be detrimental to us. The former seems most likely either that or it's not a very effective bribe.
If it is the former then it goes back to the echos of empire stuff and Britain trying to punch above its weight.
Corrupt wheels within wheels.
The likes of BAE systems and large contractors 'lobby' the grubbiment with fine dining of ministers and exclusive holidays to persuade them to give 'aid' to certain countries where the appropriate govt ministers have been wined & dined into spending that aid on buying goods and services from the UK contractors.
'cept this time where the French did the wining & dining and obviously used bigger brown envelopes!
If we give Aid to India and they give aid to another country, why bother with India in the first place? better still stop all foreign aid until the country's back on its feet.
Stop aid, full stop. It never gets to those, who it is intended to, anyway.
John Little
03-Feb-12, 23:01
You want stupid?
The UK owns $429 billion of US debt at the moment...
You want stupid?
The UK owns $429 billion of US debt at the moment...
How does one own debt?
John Little
04-Feb-12, 00:08
Apparently we buy it.
Why?
I do not know - maybe we hope to make a profit on it.
China buys a lot of US debt - more than us...
Section 4 of this explains; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt#Ownership_of_debt
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt#Ownership_of_debt) or this...
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgdO92JOXxAOdHRvb0Fpd3NndkFOdVpkY1hzdHhld Xc&hl=en_US#gid=0
You want stupid?
The UK owns $429 billion of US debt at the moment...
I think China owns the vast majority of US debt. They actually actively seek to buy it from other countries.
It's kind of similar to what a lot of banks did with bailout money: they bought government bonds. So the government gives them money on really good terms, the bank uses that money to buy government bonds which have higher interest and better returns than the bailout money.
It'll be fine, what we can do is repackage it and sell it on.
It'll be fine, what we can do is repackage it and sell it on.
Kind of like what the US did with sub-prime mortgages then sold them as AAA debt investments.
Bingo!
This time next year we'll be millionaires!
Actually, the old "Mouse That Roared" scenario becomes very attractive. Let Scotland have its Independence. When things get a bit sticky, declare war on the USA. If properly handled, this will result in the new superpowers (China and India) pumping aid into Scotland to scotch the vile oppressors of such a tiny sovereign state. Bet we'll all change our minds about aid then!
secretsquirrel
06-Feb-12, 12:01
Not to worry we can still sell aircraft to middle east counties.
Giving overseas aid is nothing new it has been happening for decades. The only problem with British aid is that we give with no strings attatched. The American, French and Japanese etc also give aid but the money has to be spent on their goods. When British aid is given the country can use it to buy from anywhere.
My father used to work in India in the 1950's and even then he would see bags of American Gift Aid Rice being openly sold in bazaars.
Lets be honest India is not the only country with corrupt officials - there is an old saying - "those that live in glasshouses should not throw stones"
Stumbled across this today: Hell hath no fury like Britain 'scorned' (http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/article2866369.ece) interesting read, particularly the last paragraph:
India's stance
The fact is that India has been extremely reluctant to take British aid and has made it clear on more than one occasion that it does not want it. As recently as last year, Union Finance Minister Pranab Mukherjee told Parliament that “‘we do not require the aid' describing it as ‘peanuts' in terms of India's massive development efforts.”
Not only that, according to The Sunday Telegraph, former Foreign Secretary Nirupama Rao, formally proposed an end to British aid from April 1, 2011, because of the “negative publicity of Indian poverty promoted by DfID (the department for international development).” But British ministers insisted that they “had spent political capital” justifying the aid to their electorate and “it would be highly embarrassing if the Indian government then pulled the plug.”
Stumbled across this today: Hell hath no fury like Britain 'scorned' (http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/article2866369.ece) interesting read, particularly the last paragraph:
The whole thing is worth reading.
Good find.
The whole thing is worth reading.
Good find.
It just beggers belief and shows how deeply human affairs run.
Maybe there's something to learn from that story about a future relationship between an independent Scotland and an England that keeps interfering.
It's an interesting article though but can't be taken in isolation from other parts of the story which is in reality international relations. It's difficult enough to live peacefully with those we love
We're not stupid but we do stupid things.[lol]
Stumbled across this today: Hell hath no fury like Britain 'scorned' (http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/article2866369.ece) interesting read, particularly the last paragraph:
Similar sort of story from the Telegraph - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/9061844/India-tells-Britain-We-dont-want-your-aid.htmlhttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/9061844/India-tells-Britain-We-dont-want-your-aid.html
oldmarine
07-Feb-12, 21:01
You want stupid?
The UK owns $429 billion of US debt at the moment...
Yes that is true and China owns even more of the US debt. I see no attempt to paying off either of these debts by the US.
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