View Full Version : Benefit Weasel
OhSL33P3R
13-Sep-11, 08:41
Ive just come to learn that a close friend of mine has managed to convince the local job center into giving him a very substantial sized crisis loan. The problem is instead of using the money in the correct way like paying off bills or buying food he went and spent it on buying himself a brand new hd tv. Now im not against the benefit system if someone is in genuine need of money & cannot find work but when people abuse the system it makes me angry for the people in need. Is this considered to be illegal ?
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 09:13
If you have any concerns report it, if it is legal no harm done. If it is not then they'll get what's coming.
I am a great supporter of the benefits system, but hate to see it abused!
Agree - report it
Benefit system is there to be used NOT ABUSED.
it annoys me when real people in hardship can not get these crisis loans and have to wait weeks for they benifits to get sorted . Then someone likes this seem to get money thrown at them . Well if the wick office shuts he will get his fare paid to inverness and have a family day out paid for by us workers that can not afford flash t,vs
I'd report it also, if you work or pay tax then you're paying for it in a way. Also what is it with people (especially neds and chavs) and massive TVs after reaching a certain size going larger is just kind of pointless.
I know plus a few others in our area where its obvoious this carry on is going on and let me say they dont appear to work and seem to be a lot better off how can they get up every morning without any guilt its so funny when they hobble about then forget i see it every day with my own eyes and they smoke so is that where our tax is going to provide for people that cant be bothered i dont even know how they can afford to even keep a car on the road its so expensive its a disgrace when their is a lot of honest people out there that worked and paid there taxes and get hardly any help when in need its a disgrace.
OhSL33P3R
13-Sep-11, 09:50
Id like to point out that i do not have any proof that he bought a tv. Im sorry i didnt mention that before, but we both share another close friend who is the one who told me & i honestly dont think he would lie. Doreen, this guy smokes aswell, like a chimmey. He is in debt up to his eyeballs but chooses to carry on smoking & thinks nothing will happen to him if he carrys on ignoring his bills. Im surprised that they have not knocked his door in already and taken his belongings to cover the payments
Perhaps he should have bought a halo with the money?
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 09:57
Id like to point out that i do not have any proof that he bought a tv. Im sorry i didnt mention that before, but we both share another close friend who is the one who told me & i honestly dont think he would lie.
So just idle speculation - nice one!
Doreen, this guy smokes aswell, like a chimmey.
There is nothing whatever that can or should prevent anyone on benefits smoking - why should it?
He is in debt up to his eyeballs but chooses to carry on smoking & thinks nothing will happen to him if he carrys on ignoring his bills. Im surprised that they have not knocked his door in already and taken his belongings to cover the payments
Debt is a totally different matter, completely unrelated to benefits - you are starting to look rather like another that believes we should remove any benefits safety net, and that all the lazy folk scrounging of the rest of society should just get off their backsides and get a job.
Hello, hello, there are no jobs!! At least not enough for all the unemployed.
There is nothing whatever that can or should prevent anyone on benefits smoking - why should it?
I'll bite.
Because smoking is a luxury, and benefits shouldn't be high enough to fund luxuries.
I'm sure the majority of PAYE taxpayers would agree.
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 10:13
I'll bite.
Because smoking is a luxury, and benefits shouldn't be high enough to fund luxuries.
I'm sure the majority of PAYE taxpayers would agree.
Not so, for anyone that smokes - I don't, and I hate and detest smoking and believe that smoking should be banned totally, but that is another debate entirely - it is not a luxury, it is a necessity. It may be foolish, but it is a fact of life. It is a choice that the individual makes.
Benefits are not design to punish, they are designed to allow someone to live with the basics covered, and yes it includes provision for telephones, TV's, transport and other such luxuries. If someone makes an unwise choice and spends food money on smoking more fool them, but it is not for us to judge.
I'll bite.
Because smoking is a luxury, and benefits shouldn't be high enough to fund luxuries.
I'm sure the majority of PAYE taxpayers would agree.Your dead right there why should the have ciggies for luxeries when it should be going towards food and things thats required so all of us taxpayers pay for there luxuries to dont think thats right.
Not so, for anyone that smokes - I don't, and I hate and detest smoking and believe that smoking should be banned totally, but that is another debate entirely - it is not a luxury, it is a necessity.
No, it is an addiction.
Addictions can be broken. I've done it.
If someone makes an unwise choice and spends food money on smoking more fool them, but it is not for us to judge.
I disagree. As the person funding this lifestyle, I feel I have every right to judge.
OhSL33P3R
13-Sep-11, 10:33
Look Nick. Ive seen your posts before on many subjects and you seem to strike me as someone who enjoys getting into arguments. Im not against people smoking that are on benefits, i just said he smokes like a chimney. The benefit system is not there to bail people of serious debt. If he had payed his bills in the first place instead of smoking, buying games & god only knows what else then he would not be in the situation he is in
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 10:36
I disagree. As the person funding this lifestyle, I feel I have every right to judge.
I truly hope that one day you find yourself in need. I also hope to be around to decide whether to throw the safety line to you, or whisk it away.
As someone who finds merit in quoting Hitler perhaps I should not be surprised at your attitude.
Do not judge a man till I have walked a mile in his shoes!
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 10:44
Look Nick. Ive seen your posts before on many subjects and you seem to strike me as someone who enjoys getting into arguments. Im not against people smoking that are on benefits, i just said he smokes like a chimney. The benefit system is not there to bail people of serious debt. If he had payed his bills in the first place instead of smoking, buying games & god only knows what else then he would not be in the situation he is in
I enjoy debate, and I also believe in saying what I think.
We agree on the smoking.
We agree the benefits system is not there to bail people out of serious debt.
We also agree that had he payed his bills in the first place instead of smoking, buying games & god only knows what else then he would not be in the situation he is in.
So as far as I can see you and me don't have any argument, and that is how I like life.
However when other people (and I don't aim this comment at you) make sweeping judgements regarding the actual choices that people on benefits make regarding spending their own money then I will always defend the rights of the benefits claimant to choose. People on benefits have all the same rights to make their own lifestyle choices as do those in work, those on pensions, those in care. People are people and deserve to be respected for that. If anyone disagrees fine, campaign for the abolition of the welfare state, or move to the USA, or Zimbabwe, or the moon, but give up bleating about you paying them. You as an individual do not - WE as a society do.
Perhaps we should have an approved list of items that are not too luxurious but are considered essentials and then the poor can go to the warehouse and pick what they need and it is handed over to them. A bit like an Argos for the down and outs. Then people like me can feel good about ourselves that we are doing them a favor and they can feel grateful for our generosity. No harm to personal dignity implied.
I truly hope that one day you find yourself in need.
I'll repeat my point.
I have no problem with the benefit system funding NEEDS.
I also hope to be around to decide whether to throw the safety line to you, or whisk it away.
Well that's fair enough. But I don't have the ability to decide right now, so I doubt you will in the future.
As someone who finds merit in quoting Hitler perhaps I should not be surprised at your attitude.
There's very few people who've had more influence on the world in the last century than Hitler.
I think there is great merit in trying to understand his views and ways. A wish to understand is not an endorsement.
OhSL33P3R
13-Sep-11, 10:50
Yes it is there choice to choose. I will fully agree with you on that. But if someone claims job seekers allowence and gets £50 a week then spends it on a game or a new mobile they cannot go running back asking for a crisis loan. People get themselves into debt & its down to them to get out of it without expecting help. The only people i have sympathy for on benefits are those who cannot find work as i know there is not much or disabled people. If someone is blowing there money on crap and is too lazy to work then i dont feel sorry for them when they get into financial trouble.
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 10:58
Yes it is there choice to choose. I will fully agree with you on that. But if someone claims job seekers allowence and gets £50 a week then spends it on a game or a new mobile they cannot go running back asking for a crisis loan. People get themselves into debt & its down to them to get out of it without expecting help. The only people i have sympathy for on benefits are those who cannot find work as i know there is not much or disabled people. If someone is blowing there money on crap and is too lazy to work then i dont feel sorry for them when they get into financial trouble.
Yet again we are in agreement - see my first response to your OP
So do you think it is also right for people claiming benefits to go to the pub every day also smoke because ive seen the regular people on the street standing outside the pub doorway chuffing there fag and i know they dont work so is that not wrong that the taxpayer has to pay for their addictions i dont know how they can afford it .
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 11:23
So do you think it is also right for people claiming benefits to go to the pub every day also smoke because ive seen the regular people on the street standing outside the pub doorway chuffing there fag and i know they dont work so is that not wrong that the taxpayer has to pay for their addictions i dont know how they can afford it .
Every individual has the right to dispose of their legitimate income - from whatever source, wages, benefits, lottery wins, investments etc - in whatever legal way they choose.
It is called freedom of choice.
If however they are playing the system and getting benefits that they are not entitled to report them.
I totally support the right of every benefits recipient to do what they want with every single penny they legitimately receive in benefits payment, provided that they do not do anything outwith the rules. There is nothing at all in the rules to prevent someone spending all their benefits on booze, cigarrettes, gambling etc.
If they do then they are foolish, but that is their right. They will become ill, they will likely die sooner. But that is their right.
If they break the rules then they should be reported and punished.
Just because people pay tax it does not give them the right to dictate how people live their lives. People that earn money often do foolish things with their earnings. things that ultimately put a burden on the tax payer. Some smoke - leading to prevetable costs to the NHS. Some go on luxury sunshine holidays - and come back with skin cancer putting a further burden on the NHS, no to mention the harm caused to the environment by the greenhouse gasses from the aircraft they fly on. But these are all choices that individuals are permitted to make in this relatively free and open society in which we all live.
Every individual has the right to dispose of their legitimate income - from whatever source, wages, benefits, lottery wins, investments etc - in whatever legal way they choose.
It is called freedom of choice.
If however they are playing the system and getting benefits that they are not entitled to report them.
I totally support the right of every benefits recipient to do what they want with every single penny they legitimately receive in benefits payment, provided that they do not do anything outwith the rules. There is nothing at all in the rules to prevent someone spending all their benefits on booze, cigarrettes, gambling etc.
If they do then they are foolish, but that is their right. They will become ill, they will likely die sooner. But that is their right.
If they break the rules then they should be reported and punished.
Just because people pay tax it does not give them the right to dictate how people live their lives. People that earn money often do foolish things with their earnings. things that ultimately put a burden on the tax payer. Some smoke - leading to prevetable costs to the NHS. Some go on luxury sunshine holidays - and come back with skin cancer putting a further burden on the NHS, no to mention the harm caused to the environment by the greenhouse gasses from the aircraft they fly on. But these are all choices that individuals are permitted to make in this relatively free and open society in which we all live.
I agree with that, the only way around it would be to give people vouchers or create a job centre 'shop' they could buy things through but that would just lead to an underground economy.
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 11:32
Thanks RecQuery - I know we don't always agree, it's nice when we can :)
Thanks RecQuery - I know we don't always agree, it's nice when we can :)
I know people with jobs who 'waste' money in my opinion and I'm sure they feel I do the same. There is an argument to be made for child abuse if people have children and are spending the money on irresponsible things and there are some benefits that could bypass the claimant and any temptation, housing benefit comes to mind.
weezer 316
13-Sep-11, 11:41
Food stamps, allocation via a govt credit card that can be used on certain catagories of items (kids clothes, food etc) and a comprehensive work for benefits scheme. Thast my solution. Dont give me any rubbish about humiliation. Whe I was 17 and signing on I was humiliated walking into the job centre. Self worth aint gonna be attained by cash handouts
I'll bite.
Because smoking is a luxury, and benefits shouldn't be high enough to fund luxuries.
I'm sure the majority of PAYE taxpayers would agree.
What if this person prefers to smoke rather than eat that big fat steak that you are probably having tonight. It his/her choice what they spend there benefits on not yours.
No, it is an addiction.
Addictions can be broken. I've done it.
I disagree. As the person funding this lifestyle, I feel I have every right to judge.
So if this person decides to spend his/her money on food instead of cigarettes do you want to go shopping with them to make sure they buy food YOU approve of.
Ive just come to learn that a close friend of mine has managed to convince the local job center into giving him a very substantial sized crisis loan. The problem is instead of using the money in the correct way like paying off bills or buying food he went and spent it on buying himself a brand new hd tv. Now im not against the benefit system if someone is in genuine need of money & cannot find work but when people abuse the system it makes me angry for the people in need. Is this considered to be illegal ?
The real point is the Magic Words.........."Crisis Loan"...........Simply put this means this Payment has to be Paid Back and the Money is taken off the Benefit every week until it is Fully Paid.
A Crisis Loan can be for anything, to get a new Carpet, new Cooker, a new Fridge or even a New TV. A Crisis Loan is not made for buying food like you think, but for larger items that cost more than the person can save up for. So if he did buy a TV it could very well be the reason he got the Crisis Loan.
Your dead right there why should the have ciggies for luxeries when it should be going towards food and things thats required so all of us taxpayers pay for there luxuries to dont think thats right.
So do you shop at Lidl or M&S. Do you spend your money wisely every week. Do you have that bar of chocolate that will only make you fat. I could go on all day, Its about life choice if they want to smoke who are we to say no. If they spent there money on best steak would we say they get to much money at should only be able to buy Jam & bread.
So do you shop at Lidl or M&S. Do you spend your money wisely every week. Do you have that bar of chocolate that will only make you fat. I could go on all day, Its about life choice if they want to smoke who are we to say no. If they spent there money on best steak would we say they get to much money at should only be able to buy Jam & bread.Yes i do shop at Lidl and i can spend my money on anything i want because i earn it so why dont we all give up our jobs and get it given on a silver platter then we can sit back all day watching our hd telly smoking drinking and having steak every night if we wanted no id rather pay my way were talking about people that is ripping of the people that want to work but cant find work and the disabled that get hardly anything some people just dont want to work .
NickInTheNorth
13-Sep-11, 12:49
Yes i do shop at Lidl and i can spend my money on anything i want because i earn it so why dont we all give up our jobs and get it given on a silver platter then we can sit back all day watching our hd telly smoking drinking and having steak every night if we wanted no id rather pay my way were talking about people that is ripping of the people that want to work but cant find work and the disabled that get hardly anything some people just dont want to work .
If we were only talking about " people that is ripping of the people that want to work but cant find work and the disabled that get hardly anything" tehn you and me would not be disagreeing. Yout statements are always made about people on benefits in general.
The proportion ripping of the system is way smaller than you seem to believe.
teddybear1873
13-Sep-11, 12:54
Now I personally don't know the In's and outs of crisis loans or whatever benefits people get, or how their paid. One option for the benefit system is to give them a credit style card, but it's only good for purchasing certain items. Eg- the food stamp card in America is only good for buying certain foods and thats all it can be used for. I wouldn't be able to buy a packet of fags or buy booze with it.
If we were only talking about " people that is ripping of the people that want to work but cant find work and the disabled that get hardly anything" tehn you and me would not be disagreeing. Yout statements are always made about people on benefits in general.
The proportion ripping of the system is way smaller than you seem to believe.No i did not say all benefit claiments i am talking about the ones that are scamming the system are you nit picking it seems you want an argument you have your opinions and so do i threr is a lot of people who are at it thats all i said.
What if this person prefers to smoke rather than eat that big fat steak that you are probably having tonight. It his/her choice what they spend there benefits on not yours.
I believe that the benefit system is there to provide the neccesities to those who can't afford them.
If somebody on benefit can afford to buy packet of cigarettes at £7+ a pop then the system is giving them more than they require.
So if this person decides to spend his/her money on food instead of cigarettes do you want to go shopping with them to make sure they buy food YOU approve of.
No, not at all.
teddybear1873
13-Sep-11, 13:14
Wonder how many people in Caithness hit the pubs when they get their crisis loans?
Would be an interesting number I bet.
Wonder how many people in Caithness hit the pubs when they get their crisis loans?
Would be an interesting number I bet.Ithink so to
Id like to point out that i do not have any proof that he bought a tv.
Step away from the window, stop twitching the curtains, and find a life for yourself.
Walter Ego
13-Sep-11, 14:28
Step away from the window, stop twitching the curtains, and find a life for yourself.
Back o'the net![lol]
Walter Ego
13-Sep-11, 14:34
OK.
I see a bloke outside a pub, he's having a ciggie and a pint. I know he signs on.
Does that make him some sort of person to be despised? Absolutely not. Moderation in all things is fine by me, if he wants to have the odd moment of relaxation, then bully for him.
OK.
I see a bloke outside a pub, he's having a ciggie and a pint. I know he signs on.
Does that make him some sort of person to be despised? Absolutely not. Moderation in all things is fine by me, if he wants to have the odd moment of relaxation, then bully for him.
Well said Walter...... Does the value of a person change if they cannot find work or are unable to do so. The constant having a go at those on benefit has become a national pastime by those who are fortunate to have work. Report those you KNOW are committing fraud and leave the rest alone to manage as best they can and stop telling them how they should spend an income that sits on the poverty line.
Well said Walter...... Does the value of a person change if they cannot find work or are unable to do so. The constant having a go at those on benefit has become a national pastime by those who are fortunate to have work. Report those you KNOW are committing fraud and leave the rest alone to manage as best they can and stop telling them how they should spend an income that sits on the poverty line.
I don't mind having a go at people who abuse something or who are deserving of it but I'd apply that principle to all parts of society, such as: corrupt politicians, tax avoiding millionaires, slave driving corporations.
teddybear1873
13-Sep-11, 16:26
I don't mind the person having a pint or a fag either. I also don't mind the person making a few bob on the side and not telling the broo.
I plenty times did jobbies on the side and didn't claim it. I felt I didn't get enough and had a family to raise. If know one likes it, well tough.
I'm not talking about making 100's every week. A few pounds here and a few pounds there. And yes, sometimes I would go for a pint to the legion or comm after I got paid.
Whatever next? Blue badge holders parking in the disable bays at tesco's!!
teddybear1873
13-Sep-11, 17:43
Whatever next? Blue badge holders parking in the disable bays at tesco's!!
No, Blue Peter one's.
I don't mind having a go at people who abuse something or who are deserving of it but I'd apply that principle to all parts of society, such as: corrupt politicians, tax avoiding millionaires, slave driving corporations.
Have a go as you say at those who abuse something but you have suggested food coupons for ALL on benefits. You even suggest that if they do not spend there benefits the way you think they should that they might be committing child abuse. Does that mean that you think because they are on benefits that they are less responsable parents than those fortunate enough to have a job?
There's a lot of talk about if the person has 'spare cash' regardless of where it came from it is their right to spend it on what they like - this really annoys me. I work full time plus more, I'm on a good wage but there is no way on this planet I could afford to smoke. There's no way I could afford to go to the pub every day, or even once a week. Once a month is probably my limit. It annoys me that people on benefits can afford to smoke - it should be for essentials only. If people on benefits can 'afford' to smoke and drink (a luxury) or buy a TV (ANY TV - a TV is a luxury also) then I believe they should have those benefits cut.
I have an (ex) friend that used to always be claiming poverty. She never had enough cash to buy nappies for the baby, juice for them to drink, healthy nutritious food for the kids. I'm not one to give people cash as I feel it's a bit demeaning but I used to treat the kids to little bits, have them round for tea a couple of nights a week, pick up the odd pack of nappies or bottle of juice. Then I realised I was getting skinter and skinter but she managed to find money to smoke 20+ a day, to drink a bottle of wine a day, to go out once a week - and pay a babysitter! I stopped being taken for a mug and cut all contact. It broke my heart as I really saw those kids suffering - little to no stimulation and a very poor diet. But not technically abuse :(
I'm broke most of the time - once I have paid the mortgage and all of the bills there is very little spare cash to spend on anything else. I don't bemoan this - I choose to live in the house I do that is at the top end of what I can afford - but I can afford it.
I think what people who do work resent is being seen as being a mug. I've heard people joke about not wanting to get a job as it's not worth it. It seems that people are better off on benefits as any cash once they have paid for food is pretty much 'spare'. If I could cope with living in the town maybe it may not be such a bad thing?
Have a go as you say at those who abuse something but you have suggested food coupons for ALL on benefits. You even suggest that if they do not spend there benefits the way you think they should that they might be committing child abuse. Does that mean that you think because they are on benefits that they are less responsable parents than those fortunate enough to have a job?
All depends on if they treat themselves better than they treat their kids...
All depends on if they treat themselves better than they treat their kids...
The same thing applies to those who have a job, living on benefits has nothing to do with being a good or bad parent.
There's a lot of talk about if the person has 'spare cash' regardless of where it came from it is their right to spend it on what they like - this really annoys me. I work full time plus more, I'm on a good wage but there is no way on this planet I could afford to smoke. There's no way I could afford to go to the pub every day, or even once a week. Once a month is probably my limit. It annoys me that people on benefits can afford to smoke - it should be for essentials only. If people on benefits can 'afford' to smoke and drink (a luxury) or buy a TV (ANY TV - a TV is a luxury also) then I believe they should have those benefits cut.
I have an (ex) friend that used to always be claiming poverty. She never had enough cash to buy nappies for the baby, juice for them to drink, healthy nutritious food for the kids. I'm not one to give people cash as I feel it's a bit demeaning but I used to treat the kids to little bits, have them round for tea a couple of nights a week, pick up the odd pack of nappies or bottle of juice. Then I realised I was getting skinter and skinter but she managed to find money to smoke 20+ a day, to drink a bottle of wine a day, to go out once a week - and pay a babysitter! I stopped being taken for a mug and cut all contact. It broke my heart as I really saw those kids suffering - little to no stimulation and a very poor diet. But not technically abuse :(
I'm broke most of the time - once I have paid the mortgage and all of the bills there is very little spare cash to spend on anything else. I don't bemoan this - I choose to live in the house I do that is at the top end of what I can afford - but I can afford it.
I think what people who do work resent is being seen as being a mug. I've heard people joke about not wanting to get a job as it's not worth it. It seems that people are better off on benefits as any cash once they have paid for food is pretty much 'spare'. If I could cope with living in the town maybe it may not be such a bad thing?
Speak for yourself, I have worked all my life and do not resent others having what they need when they need it and would never wish others to have to live below the poverty level.
If your 'friend' was neglecting her children and you felt so strongly why break your heart about them, report her for child neglect instead.
If you have such a good wage then learn a little about money management and your money might go further.
Ok guys answer this question then........IF people on benefits only got tokens instead of money that could only be used to buy food or clothes how do they manage to pay their share of council tax,electricity bills,phone bills etc? Oh and how do they manage to scrimp and save pennies every week to be able to buy something for the childs birthday or christmas?Yet again everyone is being tarred with the same brush,walk in someone who has no choice but to depend on benefits shoes for a week and see if you still think the same way.....I dare you! x
i agree have been in both side when my kids were little each have there own draw back but money is never easy if you are on benefits or a low income many a time they had hand me downs and pressies bought from car boots ect in fact i said to one of my children you can have one present this christmas that new or several tht second hand they choice second hand and was happy with what they got now days kids want to much because they parents want what they can not afford it does not matter were its benefits or work for we all want to many material thing just to keep up with the jones
I don't mind the person having a pint or a fag either. I also don't mind the person making a few bob on the side and not telling the broo.
I plenty times did jobbies on the side and didn't claim it. I felt I didn't get enough and had a family to raise. If know one likes it, well tough.
I'm not talking about making 100's every week. A few pounds here and a few pounds there. And yes, sometimes I would go for a pint to the legion or comm after I got paid.
Ooh! After an admission like that you'd better not come back :eek: Whats that?........ Extradition Treaty?:lol:
There's a lot of talk about if the person has 'spare cash' regardless of where it came from it is their right to spend it on what they like - this really annoys me. I work full time plus more, I'm on a good wage but there is no way on this planet I could afford to smoke. There's no way I could afford to go to the pub every day, or even once a week. Once a month is probably my limit. It annoys me that people on benefits can afford to smoke - it should be for essentials only. If people on benefits can 'afford' to smoke and drink (a luxury) or buy a TV (ANY TV - a TV is a luxury also) then I believe they should have those benefits cut.
I have an (ex) friend that used to always be claiming poverty. She never had enough cash to buy nappies for the baby, juice for them to drink, healthy nutritious food for the kids. I'm not one to give people cash as I feel it's a bit demeaning but I used to treat the kids to little bits, have them round for tea a couple of nights a week, pick up the odd pack of nappies or bottle of juice. Then I realised I was getting skinter and skinter but she managed to find money to smoke 20+ a day, to drink a bottle of wine a day, to go out once a week - and pay a babysitter! I stopped being taken for a mug and cut all contact. It broke my heart as I really saw those kids suffering - little to no stimulation and a very poor diet. But not technically abuse :(
I'm broke most of the time - once I have paid the mortgage and all of the bills there is very little spare cash to spend on anything else. I don't bemoan this - I choose to live in the house I do that is at the top end of what I can afford - but I can afford it.
I think what people who do work resent is being seen as being a mug. I've heard people joke about not wanting to get a job as it's not worth it. It seems that people are better off on benefits as any cash once they have paid for food is pretty much 'spare'. If I could cope with living in the town maybe it may not be such a bad thing?
I have never read so much Rubbish in all my Life. I am in receipt of benefit, Pension Credit to be exact.
If you, Leanne, think that I need your permission to spend my Pension on something you can think again. If I want to buy a bottle of wine I will and you have no right to tell me or anyone else what they can or can not spend their money on.
It might be classed as a benefit but it is one we have all earned. I have paid Taxes and National Insurance for over 50 years and then you to say I have no right to spend it on what I like is........ well Disgusting.
Leanne, you look after your Knitting and I will look after mine.
mentallywinnie
14-Sep-11, 00:08
Just wanted to chuck in my twopennthworth (can I get change though please!?)
I'm a wheelchair-using amputee with mental health problems and don't care who knows it to be honest (I'm not some mad axe murderess lol)
Anyway I'm on benefits and up till Feb 22nd this year I smoked 20/30 a day costing me about £60 each week..I CHOSE to smoke, I chose not to be able to have luxuries but who cares I've got just enough health to get me through the day.....When I gave up I put all my fag money in a tin until 16 weeks later..(I used some of it for holiday stuff but....) I ended up with £547.57 which took me down to Englandshire to meet my daughter (who I gave up for adoption ) for the first time in 20 YEARS
So are some of you saying that I either should have to surrender my smoking money/only be able to use it for food/clothes?? I'm still putting the money away as I NEED a new oven and stove (thats my next project) the ones that I have here were inherited with the house and are ancient..so no I'm not uusing money for luxuries or asking for more money (Crisis loan/budgeting loan)
Food for thought maybe??
KT
doreen ive read what trash you have wrote seems your thinking yourself some kinda dictator just because certain people play the system dont mean they all do anyways what does your opinion matter ur 1 voice in a 68 million person radius so i doubt anything you say will be acknowledged you seem disgruntled...lol at makin a warehouse for the benifit people to go to what the hell do you people think you are honestly lol@people just cant concern themselfs with there own lives they have to try and mess with others no one should be treated diffrent unless there some hardcore criminal people have feelings just because there broke dont mean they dont feel
doreen ive read what trash you have wrote seems your thinking yourself some kinda dictator just because certain people play the system dont mean they all do anyways what does your opinion matter ur 1 voice in a 68 million person radius so i doubt anything you say will be acknowledged you seem disgruntled...lol at makin a warehouse for the benifit people to go to what the hell do you people think you are honestly lol@people just cant concern themselfs with there own lives they have to try and mess with others no one should be treated diffrent unless there some hardcore criminal people have feelings just because there broke dont mean they dont feelNo if you read my posts thats not what you are implying i only stated that well say some people are ripping the system and its hardly fair on the genuine people who need it and i have every right to say what i think and you know im right so get off your high horse and i never said anything about making a warehouse for people on benefits read my posts right so if you want to have a go at me ats fair enough your aloud and there a lot more people than me that feel the same.
David Banks
14-Sep-11, 07:37
In the States, they have a "food stamps" system where there is a limited list of items it can be spent on. No booze or ciggies. Sounds like a more focussed approach, although I do not know its pros and cons in action.
OhSL33P3R
14-Sep-11, 07:40
I know im going to get an aweful lot of backlash for this but here goes, many a time i can spot a person who is on benefits simply by looking at them. Im 100% positive that more than half of the chavs in this county are on jsa. Many a time people are not good parents who are on benefits, if what leanne said is true then how is spending money on cigs, booze & going out & putting that before looking after your own children been a good parent ? It isnt, i dont blame leanne for cutting contact, Now i also know that there are parents on benefits who are great parents so i can see the coin from both sides. Fags only become essentials when you become addicted. If people want to smoke then by all means, but would it not be better to make sure you have enough money to pay the bills & get some food, then smoke the rest away instead of those who smoke first eat later. Its exactly the same with child benefit, people getting pregnant time and time just to get more money. But thats another topic for another time
Leanne has quoted one person,seen from her eyes,not everyone in general! YES you do get people who scam the system and end up very well off,but they are in the MINORITY!!Being on benefits,and sticking to all the rules to claim is a tough life,not one I have or would have chosen,but thats exactly where I am now,went from being in a successful career to claiming benefits,struggling to make ends meet and selling everything I can to get extra cash when I have to,I do it because I have no choice at the moment,there are very few jobs around!!!Complaining about benefit cheats will not change it,they simply feel they deserve the extra money,and will work for cash and take the chance on being caught,all the complaining does is make those of us who dearly wish we could find work feel even more worthless,try going and signing on every 2 weeks and see how you like it!I have seen the "scroungers" go into the DWP demand money,later sign on times etc and get everything they want....while those of us who actually do want to find gainful employment are sitting there feeling like trash!Now I know there will be plenty on here that say Oh dont take it personally,but you know what? I do!I just hope when I had my career I wasnt so up my ownself to not see that those who were unempolyed with genuine reason dont need employed people ranting about where "their" money goes!Life can change in seconds,who knows when you may need to rely on benefits? I hope you never do!x
I have never read so much Rubbish in all my Life. I am in receipt of benefit, Pension Credit to be exact.
If you, Leanne, think that I need your permission to spend my Pension on something you can think again. If I want to buy a bottle of wine I will and you have no right to tell me or anyone else what they can or can not spend their money on.
It might be classed as a benefit but it is one we have all earned. I have paid Taxes and National Insurance for over 50 years and then you to say I have no right to spend it on what I like is........ well Disgusting.
Leanne, you look after your Knitting and I will look after mine.
Pension isn't a benefit - it is something you have worked to pay into all your life - no comparison
Leanne
You obvious did not read or do not know - Pension Credit - is a part of the benefits system.
There is a pension and then to top it up you can get Pension Credits - so are you still going to tell DrChin how to spend his money he receives in old age!!!
It's all about choice. And for the poorest in society and those who are struggling on benefits choices become very limited. And yet we want to remove more of those choices because we can sit smugly in our comfy armchairs in our warm houses (that we have chosen to buy), with our choice of car on the drive, and then bemoan someone because they dare to have a pint and whinge if they have a ciggie. Chances are they might not be living in a house / area they like and do not have a car so once you've compensated the costings factored into those you'll see where the money is. That you have chosen to spend, as you like.
It is certainly true that there is a certain number of people claiming benefit that have no intention of ever trying to do anything with themselves other than take whatever is handed out to them and pish it up the wall. But, there are far more genuinely struggling to make a little go a long way. The problem is we see the ones taking the mickey far more than the ones struggling, and when we do see the ones struggling we just choose assume they are taking the mickey like the others.
The issue, albeit a subjective one, is priorities. And where you, I and those in receipt of benefits see those priorities. I do believe however, that those with children have more responsibility to those children than they have for their own personal choices and as such have certain priorities mapped out for them, whether they see it the same way is, again, subjective.
Anyway, back to the Daily Mail.......
OhSL33P3R
14-Sep-11, 11:39
Phill thats my main point. Im all for people going on benefits if there is no other option. For example they get fired and cannot get a job anywhere else. But all the people who simply leave school with no ambition other than to spend the majority of their time getting drunk & lighting up are the people i have problems with. Im not bothered who you are or where your from but whatever money you get wether its from working or not, should go towards the more important things first. Like council tax & rent. I have lost count of the amount of people i know who are on benefits, spend their money or crap then sit there complaining they have nothing left for food & bills. They then go crawling to their friends & family scrounging every penny they can get with no intention whatsoever of giving it back.
...Im all for people going on benefits if there is no other option. For example they get fired and cannot get a job anywhere else. But all the people who simply leave school with no ambition other than to spend the majority of their time getting drunk & lighting up are the people i have problems with...
I think most of those people now go to the local college, take a one year course, repeat it for three or four years and then go on benefits. I'm pretty sure that Caithness has the highest number of Hairdressers/Chefs/Welders/Equestrians in the country.
OhSL33P3R
14-Sep-11, 13:38
I think your wrong but your entitled to their opinion. Granted there are probably hundreds of people who go to the college in wick & thurso (which i heard now has university status, dont know if thats true or not) but i believe there are hundreds if not more on benefits,
Conclusion:-
Either grass them up or deal with it.
I think most of those people now go to the local college, take a one year course, repeat it for three or four years and then go on benefits. I'm pretty sure that Caithness has the highest number of Hairdressers/Chefs/Welders/Equestrians in the country.
How true, keeps the government unemployment figures down, fine and dandy - its a shame on those that really try and cannot get work due to the fact there are loads of chefs, beauticians, hairdressers, equestrians floating around doing course after course but at least it keeps them out of mischief, its them that fall out of school at 16 into council houses, getting pregnant to get more money what a generation we have bred and lord help the next generation.
Conclusion:-
Either grass them up or deal with it.
Probably the best advice on this thread.
George Brims
14-Sep-11, 21:03
In the US a lot of benefits are paid in the form of Food Stamps. Nowadays it's a debit card, but the rules are the same - no booze or ciggies, food only. When it was the stamps they came in units of $10, $5, $1 etc and change was only given for less than a dollar. The supermarket queue used to get clogged up with people buying their food in stages so they could pile up enough change for a beer or two.
In the US a lot of benefits are paid in the form of Food Stamps. Nowadays it's a debit card, but the rules are the same - no booze or ciggies, food only. When it was the stamps they came in units of $10, $5, $1 etc and change was only given for less than a dollar. The supermarket queue used to get clogged up with people buying their food in stages so they could pile up enough change for a beer or two.
I have read on many posts in many threads that in the US that people claiming benefit received Food Stamps as their Benefit. This is or was done to make sure that food was bought.
I have always wondered if the only benefit they received was in Food stamps, how did someone on Benefit pay for their Gas, Electricty, Telephone, Water and sewage plus any other Taxes they they would have to pay. Are they not allowed a family life, ie perhaps to buy a son, daughter, wife or husband a birthday present or card. Also what happened over Christmas, did Santa bring a packet of Crackers for the Kids.
Personally I can not see Food Stamps working here in the UK, people would stock up with tin food and sell it on eBay to get cash.
How true, keeps the government unemployment figures down, fine and dandy - its a shame on those that really try and cannot get work due to the fact there are loads of chefs, beauticians, hairdressers, equestrians floating around doing course after course but at least it keeps them out of mischief, its them that fall out of school at 16 into council houses, getting pregnant to get more money what a generation we have bred and lord help the next generation.
It even happens at universities but to a lesser extent. One of my flatmates repeated the first year of his course four times and got funding each time, he then dropped out, worked at the local BT call centre for a while until he got bored and then joined the navy. I don't mind giving people funding to repeat a year once but four times is a bit overboard. There are historic examples also such as classing people as long term sick to lower the unemployment numbers.
NickInTheNorth
15-Sep-11, 09:23
It even happens at universities but to a lesser extent. One of my flatmates repeated the first year of his course four times and got funding each time, he then dropped out, worked at the local BT call centre for a while until he got bored and then joined the navy. I don't mind giving people funding to repeat a year once but four times is a bit overboard. There are historic examples also such as classing people as long term sick to lower the unemployment numbers.
To get funding to repeat a year once is incredibly difficult, and I am pretty certain impossible to get to repeat 4 times, in addition no academic institution worth it's acreditation would allow a student to take a single year a total of 5 times.
annemarie482
15-Sep-11, 10:01
Food stamps, allocation via a govt credit card that can be used on certain catagories of items (kids clothes, food etc) and a comprehensive work for benefits scheme. Thast my solution. Dont give me any rubbish about humiliation. Whe I was 17 and signing on I was humiliated walking into the job centre. Self worth aint gonna be attained by cash handouts
my thoughts exactly!!
To get funding to repeat a year once is incredibly difficult, and I am pretty certain impossible to get to repeat 4 times, in addition no academic institution worth it's acreditation would allow a student to take a single year a total of 5 times.
Oh he managed it, through faking, begging and blagging, his dad was a Minister so he got him involved at one point. There was always something dodgy about that guy, he was impossible to get money from for bills also in the end we had to go directly to his dad ourselves I'm surprised he never went AWOL from the navy or something like that. Half way through he did change degree programme, same area just a slightly different specialisation. I know a couple of people who had to repeat a single year but that was understandable given their circumstances.
secrets in symmetry
17-Sep-11, 00:42
It even happens at universities but to a lesser extent. One of my flatmates repeated the first year of his course four times and got funding each time, he then dropped out, worked at the local BT call centre for a while until he got bored and then joined the navy. I don't mind giving people funding to repeat a year once but four times is a bit overboard. There are historic examples also such as classing people as long term sick to lower the unemployment numbers.Were you at the university formerly known as Peckham Polytechnic?
teddybear1873
17-Sep-11, 15:49
I have read on many posts in many threads that in the US that people claiming benefit received Food Stamps as their Benefit. This is or was done to make sure that food was bought.
I have always wondered if the only benefit they received was in Food stamps, how did someone on Benefit pay for their Gas, Electricty, Telephone, Water and sewage plus any other Taxes they they would have to pay. Are they not allowed a family life, ie perhaps to buy a son, daughter, wife or husband a birthday present or card. Also what happened over Christmas, did Santa bring a packet of Crackers for the Kids.
Personally I can not see Food Stamps working here in the UK, people would stock up with tin food and sell it on eBay to get cash.
I don't think US government hand out money, but if someone needs help to pay the gas or electricity bill, they have to apply at some sort of charity organization eg- Salvation Army. As far as I'm aware of the only time Uncle Sam will give someone $$ is at the end of the tax year.
As for food stamps, more and more people are getting them here. It did say on the news not that long ago that around 45 million Americans get them.
It's a shame that McDonalds don't take food stamps, I'm sure their profit will sky rocket :roll:
Benefits sytem loan service is very good, you pay it back out of benefits, interest free, so no ones keeping the money.
Sadly all us other mugs have to pay interest.
weezer 316
19-Sep-11, 21:37
Governmetn debit card.....I tell you its the answer. Similar to the smart cards in school we used to have. It can only be used to buy a certain class of things (we werent able to buy sweets when they first came out haha) and it would make sure for example that there was nobody spending it all in the pub unless they sold thiers.
Governmetn debit card.....I tell you its the answer. Similar to the smart cards in school we used to have. It can only be used to buy a certain class of things (we werent able to buy sweets when they first came out haha) and it would make sure for example that there was nobody spending it all in the pub unless they sold thiers.
Government debit card ...... I tell you that is not the answer. We are not talking about children in school or the USA but about adults who want to work and cannot get work. Why do people feel the need to try and denigrate those who are having a hard enough time managing to survive on the poverty level. Yes there are those who abuse the system, there are present in every level of our society. If having a go at others makes you feel better then why not pick of the fat cats who are so greedy that they break the law with tax evasion. They deserve it more that those trying to survive on the poverty level.
Benefits sytem loan service is very good, you pay it back out of benefits, interest free, so no ones keeping the money.
Sadly all us other mugs have to pay interest.
Speak for yourself, I am grateful that I have the income to be able to pay interest on anything I should borrow.
Whatever next? Blue badge holders parking in the disable bays at tesco's!!
You cant get in most disabled parking spaces because they are full of none badge holders especially Taxi drivers using the space for personal use.
You cant get in most disabled parking spaces because they are full of none badge holders especially Taxi drivers using the space for personal use.
As the tesco car park is usually half empty that is not a problem for this blue badge holder.
rogermellie
24-Sep-11, 23:56
there are people out there who make a career out of cheating the benefits system and then pass on this wisdom to their brood (of which there are many)
generations of families who have all been on the brew and do their best to stay there
they're fit enough to spend all day in tescos and the charity shops, but when it comes to doing it for a living or voluntary work, all of a sudden their back goes :confused
ShelleyCowie
25-Sep-11, 00:04
Reading these replies, i see alot of "i have a friend who knows a guy who cheats the system/is a chav/badparent"
I have never claimed JSA or been to the broo, i dont judge people who do. There are a lack of jobs BUT in the minority there are people who dont want to work. The ones who flash it around that they choose not to work because they cant be bothered.
But anyhoo, if people choose to smoke, have a little luxury if they have saved up for it, a bottle of wine once a month or so, then thats fine. Who are we to judge people that we dont really know? :confused
As i said, iv never claimed benefits, i very rarely drink, i smoke, and i dont work. Not because i dont want to, but because i dont have too. My husband works his butt off through a disablement so i can stay at home.
Tell me, do i have the right to smoke?! C'mon gimme permission cos i need a cig :lol:
rogermellie
25-Sep-11, 00:24
your husbands a saint working his ass off so you can stay at home causing trouble on the org smoking fags all day long ;)
Tell me, do i have the right to smoke?! C'mon gimme permission cos i need a cig :lol:
You can spend the money your family has earned in any way you want Shelley!
But anyhoo, if people choose to smoke, have a little luxury if they have saved up for it, a bottle of wine once a month or so, then thats fine.
I think that's a bad comparison. How does the price of a bottle of wine compare with the price of a pack of fags? Not to mention that there's not many smokers who could make a pack last anywhere near a month!
Who are we to judge people that we dont really know? :confused
It's not about judging people Shelley, it's about judging how our taxes are spent.
2little2late
25-Sep-11, 00:33
your husbands a saint working his ass off so you can stay at home causing trouble on the org smoking fags all day long ;)
Well said. There's too many spongers in this world.
rogermellie
25-Sep-11, 00:35
Well said. There's too many spongers in this world.
wait now, lets not judge shelley, i'm sure she darns his socks and has a hot meal ready for him every night he comes home
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