View Full Version : Should Andy Gray have been given the sack?
Do you think that Andy Gray deserved the sack for his comments about the female linesman or do you think that they wanted rid of him anyway and used the incident as a convenient excuse to fire him?
Chrisf1961
29-Jan-11, 18:44
no it was all just banter
Stack Rock
29-Jan-11, 18:56
Definately not - just banter. The media made a meal of this also just to keep it going. Was said off air so some-one had it in for them. Now-a-days you can't say anything about any-one without being criticised. Freedom of speech has gone out the window.
He wasnt sacked for his sexist remarks about the assistant referee but because of his lewd comments towards a female colleague.
Like most older men, myself included, he needs a course to remind him that the banter he thinks was banter 20 years ago is no longer acceptable.
Had he taken the course, then I doubt there was any need to sack him. He could have been held up as the face of the modern reformed macho man who treats a women as a person and not an object.
No - definitely not. As previously mentioned, the comments were made off-air, so should never have been in the public domain.
Also, the comments made to a female co-worker were never an issue at the time or she would have complained. Just a bit of banter between colleagues!
Life is going to get pretty boring if these things keep happening!! Are comedians going to be allowed to joke about anything or are any joke comments going to be outlawed????
The tone wasn't banter and ironically he was the one that was wrong about the referee assistant's decision. All referee's and assistants get things wrong every weekend. The comments should have been directed at them not their gender. Taking it to the next step if he has a problem with the way the offside rule he should complain to the FA.
The Drunken Duck
29-Jan-11, 19:13
There are rumours that Sky wanted rid of him and this would be a convinent way to do so. The footage was leaked by his employer which makes this affair a bit suspicious to be honest.
But it is a storm in a teacup, Jo Brand told a joke on air that if any man had said the same about a women the brown stuff would have hit the fan. When asked what type of man she preferred she replied with "a dead one". A female friend told me she heard worse said about men on Loose Women than what Andy Gray said. There will always be banter between the sexes, both sides see the other as sex objects and objects of ridicule to some degree. I had three girls working for me once and they were worse than the blokes a lot of the time, it has gone on, still goes on and will continue to go on. I am not offended by Jo Brand's joke at all. The day I care what she says is the day I find a tall building and leap off.
Anyway I heard the female lineswoman wasnt bothered about the remarks. But she was REALLY upset that she turned up to the game in the same outfit as the referee.
Not the first time or the second his remarks have raised eyebrows.
He is also in the process of suing his employer at Sky - Mr Murdoch of the New Of The World re phone hacking, so all in all not surprised got the boot.
Yes !!!!!
He has always been a big-head, know it all and a bit of a bully and a football commentator he was not!!! I cant believe Sky coudnt have got someone better than him and Keys !!
I would also sack the person who gave them the job in the first place !!!
Good riddance is what I say, nothing wrong at all in having Female Refs and Linepersons, they are probably better at it than the Men!!!
C3....:eek::roll:
If Charlotte Jackson did not complain about him, I do not think it was a sackable offence and while it did not come over as banter, it was 'old man's banter' and I have heard and been the subject of worse. More to it than that and I for one will miss--Take a bow son, take-a-bow
Walter Ego
29-Jan-11, 21:16
A friend of mine had the misfortune to attend a 'do' with Mr Gray many years back.
Her comment was that she has met very few men who could be as obnoxious and lewd as him.
Yes-His only job was to be a professional communicator-Fail :roll:
I watch football and a lot of other sports with my hubby!
The lineswoman would have known for sure that she would encounter some stick!!
Good for her to take it on the chin and get on with it!
If you were honest with yourselves how many of us make sexist comments, women can't drive,women should have the tea on the table when you walk in from work etc!
Or us women saying our husbands wouldn't know where the hoover was kept or how to use the washing machine?
Andy Gray didn't realise his michrophone was on neither did Richard Keyes it was just a couple of men having a bit of cheeky fun!!
Football and rugby has always been a male dominated sport!
like it or not!!
But the introduction of a lineswoman in football or rugby is bound to cause a bit of a stir! :roll:
Andy Gray didn't realise his michrophone was on neither did Richard Keyes it was just a couple of men having a bit of cheeky fun!!
No it wasn't, there was real bitterness in their tone and no sense whatever of being tounge-in-cheek.
People have mentioned comedians getting away with worse. This has no relevance whatever to the scenario here. Gray and Keys were employed by and representatives of SKY. They are supposed to be professional and impartial. More than simply being sexist, they were putting into question a person's ability to do THEIR job.
Andy Gray has had five kids to four different women, he is a serial cheat on his partners. He's managed to pull plenty of female attention despite being no oil painting himself. I dare say his TV exposure and £1.7 Million a year salary has helped in that department though. Most of the feedback I have had on Andy suggests he is arrogant, Richard Keys was more famous for having really hairy hands, rather than anything else back in the early days of SKY.
If middle/age/nearly elderly men can't grow up and get with times, then there is little hope for the younger mob who get their early impressions about women from the lad's mags making the shelves groan under the weight of silcion bosoms spilling off the front cover and obscuring Gardener's World.
We took man out of the cave but the cave has not yet left the man.
Andy Gray's last broadcast on the telestrator:-
"If you follow the yellow arrows here....and here...., you can see Richard and Me leaving the building"
wickblast
30-Jan-11, 09:54
have you been to a football match? 50 000 people each week question the ability of the match officials men or woman should we all be sacked .A couple of guys said something in banter thats been taken a wee bit to far
No it wasn't, there was real bitterness in their tone and no sense whatever of being tounge-in-cheek.
People have mentioned comedians getting away with worse. This has no relevance whatever to the scenario here. Gray and Keys were employed by and representatives of SKY. They are supposed to be professional and impartial. More than simply being sexist, they were putting into question a person's ability to do THEIR job.
Andy Gray has had five kids to four different women, he is a serial cheat on his partners. He's managed to pull plenty of female attention despite being no oil painting himself. I dare say his TV exposure and £1.7 Million a year salary has helped in that department though. Most of the feedback I have had on Andy suggests he is arrogant, Richard Keys was more famous for having really hairy hands, rather than anything else back in the early days of SKY.
If middle/age/nearly elderly men can't grow up and get with times, then there is little hope for the younger mob who get their early impressions about women from the lad's mags making the shelves groan under the weight of silcion bosoms spilling off the front cover and obscuring Gardener's World.
We took man out of the cave but the cave has not yet left the man.
Andy Gray's last broadcast on the telestrator:-
"If you follow the yellow arrows here....and here...., you can see Richard and Me leaving the building"
I thought we were supposed to be talking about the incident when Gray and Keyes were caught on their micrphones ( which wasn't supposed to be broadcasted as they were off air! )
NOT how many children he has by different partners or his as you say serial cheating!!
Or that Richard Keyes has hairy hands????? What's that got to do with it????
If the comments were made live on air fair enough, but how and why were those comments made available to us anyway?????? :confused
changilass
30-Jan-11, 12:10
YES
The fact that the microphones were off is irrelevant, it was still sexism in the workplace.
His workplace is the studio, not the microphone.
If Charlotte Jackson did not complain about him, I do not think it was a sackable offence and while it did not come over as banter, it was 'old man's banter' and I have heard and been the subject of worse. More to it than that and I for one will miss--Take a bow son, take-a-bow
Sexual harrassment is still sexual harrassment whether the victim complains or not. Anyone witnessing the scene is at liberty to complain too.
YES
The fact that the microphones were off is irrelevant, it was still sexism in the workplace.
His workplace is the studio, not the microphone.
Have a word with yourself!!
It was banter between two men which goes on day in day out!
Not to be sexist women do it too believe it or not!!
whether it's in work or down the pub both men and women do it!!
The lineswoman proved her salt anyhow( live on air ) by getting the judgement right anyway!! :eek:
Have a word with yourself!!
It was banter between two men which goes on day in day out!
Not to be sexist women do it too believe it or not!!
whether it's in work or down the pub both men and women do it!!
The lineswoman proved her salt anyhow( live on air ) by getting the judgement right anyway!! :eek:
The fact that both sexes do it, doesn't make it right.
The lineswoman is Sian Massey!!
I bet she couldn't care less what was said anyway, she was too busy concentrating on her job and thoroughly enjoying it!!
Good for her for ignoring it!! :)
The fact that both sexes do it, doesn't make it right.
When are people going to realise you will never make everything right??
That's the real world not an ideal world!!!! :mad:
When are people going to realise you will never make everything right??
That's the real world not an ideal world!!!! :mad:
Ah yes ... the real world. We live in hope though.
Sorry about your 'mad' smiley. Hope you have calmed down now.
I thought we were supposed to be talking about the incident when Gray and Keyes were caught on their micrphones ( which wasn't supposed to be broadcasted as they were off air! )
NOT how many children he has by different partners or his as you say serial cheating!!
Or that Richard Keyes has hairy hands????? What's that got to do with it????
If the comments were made live on air fair enough, but how and why were those comments made available to us anyway?????? :confused
That's precisely what I was getting at but I wondered whether anyone else thought the way I did. If they are the type to indulge in laddish banter I'm sure that it's not the first time they've said something controversial off-camera in the years they've been with Sky so why choose to make this incident public?
The 'revelations' about Gray's private life haven't just come to light but someone has decided to throw them into the mix for good measure. Just to put the tin lid on it, Sky has chosen to find other 'incriminating' footage to justify the sacking.
Find me some lassie who hasn't had a 'tuck this in for me' type remark thrown at them and I'll bet she's a nun.
I personally don't care one way or the other whether he keeps his job with the £1.7m salary but to highlight the reason for the sacking in this way leaves the door wide open for similar sexist cases. I'm sure that the woman who was the butt of the remarks has heard it all before and is mature enough to take them on the chin and get on with her job. To hell with the PC brigade and their imagined slurs. Men and women are different and that's what makes the world interesting.
Ah yes ... the real world. We live in hope though.
Sorry about your 'mad' smiley. Hope you have calmed down now.
No i haven't !!
Live in hope to get rid of sexism, racism ,sizism, agism etc!?
Well when it happens let me know!!
Then i'll wake up and smell the roses!!! [lol]
That's precisely what I was getting at but I wondered whether anyone else thought the way I did. If they are the type to indulge in laddish banter I'm sure that it's not the first time they've said something controversial off-camera in the years they've been with Sky so why choose to make this incident public?
The 'revelations' about Gray's private life haven't just come to light but someone has decided to throw them into the mix for good measure. Just to put the tin lid on it, Sky has chosen to find other 'incriminating' footage to justify the sacking.
Find me some lassie who hasn't had a 'tuck this in for me' type remark thrown at them and I'll bet she's a nun.
I personally don't care one way or the other whether he keeps his job with the £1.7m salary but to highlight the reason for the sacking in this way leaves the door wide open for similar sexist cases. I'm sure that the woman who was the butt of the remarks has heard it all before and is mature enough to take them on the chin and get on with her job. To hell with the PC brigade and their imagined slurs. Men and women are different and that's what makes the world interesting.
Here,here!!
At last someone lives in the real world! :)
No i haven't !!
Live in hope to get rid of sexism, racism ,sizism, agism etc!?
Well when it happens let me know!!
Then i'll wake up and smell the roses!!! [lol]
Really don't see anything wrong with striving to rid the world of those 'isms'. If that makes me an idealist, I can live with that. Although recognising that they exist (and are not good qualities to be recommending to our children), surely takes some realistic thinking too.
I thought we were supposed to be talking about the incident when Gray and Keyes were caught on their micrphones ( which wasn't supposed to be broadcasted as they were off air! )
NOT how many children he has by different partners or his as you say serial cheating!!
Or that Richard Keyes has hairy hands????? What's that got to do with it????
If the comments were made live on air fair enough, but how and why were those comments made available to us anyway?????? :confused
Andy Gray's personal history gives us a picture of how he views women in general. Richard Keys was pretty much a non-entity was the point I was making.
We live in an age where personalities are subjected to constant scrutiny. If you are going to pass unsavoury remarks you should be doing so in private or down the pub with like minded stereotypes, rather than at your place of work, where you are being paid to be professional and at least pretend that you are neutral in your opinions.
The remarks WERE said and we DID hear about them. That is end of story. You cannot control what people THINK but once the mouth opens and the words are uttered, then the damage is potentially done.
Andy Gray stated that "Women don't understand the offside rule"
Do you agree with that statement? Can you get your head round the infinite complexities that only the male brain can understand? Or is it as Andy said, and the tiny female brain cannot comprehend the mysteries of it?
I know I would be insulted if such a statement were made to me by a woman, claiming that my male brain was incapable of a fairly simple piece of interpretation.
As far a Sian Massey not being bothered by it, WE do not know how she really feels. Unlike Messrs Gray and Keys, she has been PROFESSIONAL and made all the right statements to try to get on with her career. Ms Massey was due to officiate in a match on Tuesday past but was replaced at short notice. I am sure this is due to fears of a backlash following Gray's sacking. Perhaps this will still follow her around but it is certain that if she had made a big fuss about being upset by the comments then she would be getting stick that would perhaps lead to the end of her career due to being hounded by the low life that idolise people who can talk welly for big money on TV but can't sustain a stable relationship or be true to his partners off screen.
Andy Gray's personal history gives us a picture of how he views women in general. Richard Keys was pretty much a non-entity was the point I was making.
We live in an age where personalities are subjected to constant scrutiny. If you are going to pass unsavoury remarks you should be doing so in private or down the pub with like minded stereotypes, rather than at your place of work, where you are being paid to be professional and at least pretend that you are neutral in your opinions.
The remarks WERE said and we DID hear about them. That is end of story. You cannot control what people THINK but once the mouth opens and the words are uttered, then the damage is potentially done.
Andy Gray stated that "Women don't understand the offside rule"
Do you agree with that statement? Can you get your head round the infinite complexities that only the male brain can understand? Or is it as Andy said, and the tiny female brain cannot comprehend the mysteries of it?
I know I would be insulted if such a statement were made to me by a woman, claiming that my male brain was incapable of a fairly simple piece of interpretation.
As far a Sian Massey not being bothered by it, WE do not know how she really feels. Unlike Messrs Gray and Keys, she has been PROFESSIONAL and made all the right statements to try to get on with her career. Ms Massey was due to officiate in a match on Tuesday past but was replaced at short notice. I am sure this is due to fears of a backlash following Gray's sacking. Perhaps this will still follow her around but it is certain that if she had made a big fuss about being upset by the comments then she would be getting stick that would perhaps lead to the end of her career due to being hounded by the low life that idolise people who can talk welly for big money on TV but can't sustain a stable relationship or be true to his partners off screen.
Thank you Scorrie. You have taken the time to set out the case very clearly - 'fraid I was just too lazy to do so.
They haven't even got the brains to learn from Gordon Browns famous "Bigot" gaff, now tell me, what do Sky pay them all that money for? They are sexist, cant get an offside decision right and cannot learn from others!
The dole is the best place for the pair of them!!
C3....:eek:
:lol:
Thank you Scorrie. You have taken the time to set out the case very clearly - 'fraid I was just too lazy to do so.
Getting a man do do the dirty work?? :lol:
:lol:
Getting a man do do the dirty work?? :lol:
No dirty work involved. Just a logical, common sense response - without being emotive.
Hmmm difficult one. A private conversation caught on microphone which then became public. The problem with that was that the two of them expressed opinions that were contrary to the point of view of their employer and everything football's
important people want to portray, modern, equal, fair etc etc.
Allowing yourself to be seen to be at odds with the stated aims and objectives of your employers and their key partners will almost ineviably lead to disciplinary action. Look at the referee saga recently ... Same thing. The 'tuck it in ' comments in the studio were inappropriate but I think it was a bit harsh to lose his job cos of it. In isolation it perhaps was just a stupid bit of banter but having already disciplined him his employer could not ignore it.
There is something that bothers me about all this and worries me in general about sexual innuendo between menand women in the workplace and it is this. How good are we at teaching our girls to stick up for themselves if whenever a dirty old man makes a smutty comment the answer is to report them for sexual harrassment and have someone else deal with it? Don't get me wrong ... Sexual harrassment is not acceptable . Lewd comments are neither funny nor appropriate but surely we should teach our girls to deal effectively with the low level stuff. Slapped face, ascerbic put downs and assertiveness can often be very effective in putting guys in their place. Often more so than a course on the subject. And by god, it makes you feel good. It's empowering to put a letch in their place and it puts you as a woman, in control.
If the harrassment is persistent or approaching indecent assault then of course it must be reported but really, girls, some letchy old footballer asking to have his mike tucked intohis trousers is not beyond a witty ascerbic put down that makes him think twice next time.
Andy Gray's personal history gives us a picture of how he views women in general. Richard Keys was pretty much a non-entity was the point I was making.
We live in an age where personalities are subjected to constant scrutiny. If you are going to pass unsavoury remarks you should be doing so in private or down the pub with like minded stereotypes, rather than at your place of work, where you are being paid to be professional and at least pretend that you are neutral in your opinions.
The remarks WERE said and we DID hear about them. That is end of story. You cannot control what people THINK but once the mouth opens and the words are uttered, then the damage is potentially done.
Andy Gray stated that "Women don't understand the offside rule"
Do you agree with that statement? Can you get your head round the infinite complexities that only the male brain can understand? Or is it as Andy said, and the tiny female brain cannot comprehend the mysteries of it?
I know I would be insulted if such a statement were made to me by a woman, claiming that my male brain was incapable of a fairly simple piece of interpretation.
As far a Sian Massey not being bothered by it, WE do not know how she really feels. Unlike Messrs Gray and Keys, she has been PROFESSIONAL and made all the right statements to try to get on with her career. Ms Massey was due to officiate in a match on Tuesday past but was replaced at short notice. I am sure this is due to fears of a backlash following Gray's sacking. Perhaps this will still follow her around but it is certain that if she had made a big fuss about being upset by the comments then she would be getting stick that would perhaps lead to the end of her career due to being hounded by the low life that idolise people who can talk welly for big money on TV but can't sustain a stable relationship or be true to his partners off screen.
As far as the offside rule goes, I did say that she got the judgement right live on air!
I also said( i bet ) in other words (my guess), she wasn't bothered by what was said!
Isn't that the same as you saying you are (sure )the reason for her being replaced on tuesday for fears of a backlash from the sacking of Andy Gray , how are you sure?
As far as the rest of it goes i'm made of better stuff by raising above the playground banter and ignoring it!
My brain may be tiny who cares? :eek:
The Drunken Duck
30-Jan-11, 16:46
They haven't even got the brains to learn from Gordon Browns famous "Bigot" gaff, now tell me, what do Sky pay them all that money for? They are sexist, cant get an offside decision right and cannot learn from others!
The dole is the best place for the pair of them!!
C3....:eek:
Sorry but didnt you post a few posts back that women were probably better than the men at being linesmen/referees ??, So how exactly does that make you any different to the view you take of them ??, Andy Gray was sacked, amongst other things for saying that women didnt know the offside rule, something you call him sexist for. Yet you have done the same by stating that women are probably better then men at the job. What exactly is the difference between the implication of what Andy Gray said and what you said ??
Football ran fine without female officials, thereby making your comment look not only sexist but daft as well. Or are you one of these people that think sexism is just something that men indulge in. Because go turn on Loose Women or Jo Brand as two examples of blatant sexism towards men ON AIR and yet nothing is done. Why is that exactly ??, is it because of people like you who apply one standard to one gender and another to the opposite ?? .. Survey says .. UH .. UH. Personally I am sick of people like you who hide behind their own double standards. Your the type who would, and in fact just have, quite willingly make a comment along the lines of what you said in the quote above but if the same were directed at you would be the first to whinge bitch and moan.
So Andy Gray said women dont know the offside rule .. you know what most of the women I know dont !!, so he made a jibe at a female presenter ??, big deal. I have had worse said to me by women on more than one occasion (I worked in a section once where I had six girls working for me) but you dont see me making a big issue about it and anyone who has seen a group of women at a Chippendales night will see the blatant hypocrisy in women claiming the high ground on sexism every time it suits. Both sexes do it, trouble is in todays society you can only get away with it if your female. I am sure though that Andy Gray, a pundit I dont particularly like to be honest, gives a toss what the likes of you and Scorrie thinks. Scorrie probably thinks he pays his wages through his licence fee .. you dont in case you were wondering.
All this is is the usual dullards who jump to the medias tune. The type that cant wait to jump on the outrage bus, predictable and sad.
...........
If the harrassment is persistent or approaching indecent assault then of course it must be reported but really, girls, some letchy old footballer asking to have his mike tucked intohis trousers is not beyond a witty ascerbic put down that makes him think twice next time.
I agree with virtually all that you say Squidge but, unfortunately, not all of us are able to come up with an appropriate retort quickly enough. I, for one, have often come up with the perfect come back a crucial minute or two later.
...........
So Andy Gray said women dont know the offside rule .. you know what most of the women I know dont !!, .
How many of those are employed as Assistant Referees?
I am so glad that i was told that sticks and stones would break your bones but names would never hurt me!!
Unless you are physically hurt by someone, man or woman, ignore it!!
As far as the offside rule goes, I did say that she got the judgement right live on air!
I also said( i bet ) in other words (my guess), she wasn't bothered by what was said!
Isn't that the same as you saying you are (sure )the reason for her being replaced on tuesday for fears of a backlash from the sacking of Andy Gray , how are you sure?
As far as the rest of it goes i'm made of better stuff by raising above the playground banter and ignoring it!
My brain may be tiny who cares? :eek:
I actually asked whether YOU understood the offside rule and whether it was insulting to suggest that women couldn't understand it.
How am I sure about the reason she was pulled from the game?(and incidentally now a second game) well it is simply that the General Manager of the Professional Game Match Officials has told us so!!
From Coventry Telegraph online:-
"Miss Massey agreed to stand down from the League Two clash between Crewe and Bradford after discussions with the organisation which appoints referees.
It was felt the “intense focus” on her would overshadow the game.
Mike Riley, general manager of Professional Game Match Officials, said: “The PGMO and Sian believe that with any football match the focus should not be on the officials but on the players and the game itself."
You will note that the words intense focus are used in inverted commas.
If you are happy with the notion that certain males consider that your brain is tiny, then that is absolutely fine. I would wager many women would not be however.
What Andy Gray inferred was that Sian Massey was:- Thick, can't do the job properly and was also ugly. Of course it's all for the banter.
Football ran fine without female officials
So Andy Gray said women dont know the offside rule .. you know what most of the women I know dont !!
I am sure though that Andy Gray, a pundit I dont particularly like to be honest, gives a toss what the likes of you and Scorrie thinks. Scorrie probably thinks he pays his wages through his licence fee .. you dont in case you were wondering.
What makes you think football cannot run fine WITH female officials? I don't see any law stating that they cannot enter the profession.
How many of your female friends are assistant referees? Remember Andy's statement covered ALL, not SOME, women.
Getting a bit personal now are we? Andy Gray doesn't know me or give a toss about what I say. How does this relate to me putting MY opinion on a PUBLIC forum? Every single thing put on this forum could be condemned as "Insert relevant name...doesn't give a toss"
If Loose Women bothers you so much then make a complaint. If they gave me any gyp I would simply refer to them as "Slack Slappers" rather than Loose Women ;)
People are putting their opinions here, no need to be calling anyone dullards, it simply undermines your credibility.
No as i am a woman i forget what the off side rule is until it is explained to me again!! ( it's my pea sized brain ) !!
What ever Andy Gray and Richard Keyes
said they didn't physically hurt her did they?
Name calling wasn't it?? Like i said sticks and stones!!!
Do you really believe that people who pay a fortune sometimes to see a match would sit there watching the lineswoman for the whole match?
Again i said she proved herself by making the right decision!
Let her do the job she obviously loves doing! As far as a wager goes i wouldn't want you to lose your money!!!!
Hmmm difficult one. A private conversation caught on microphone which then became public. The problem with that was that the two of them expressed opinions that were contrary to the point of view of their employer and everything football's
important people want to portray, modern, equal, fair etc etc.
Allowing yourself to be seen to be at odds with the stated aims and objectives of your employers and their key partners will almost ineviably lead to disciplinary action. Look at the referee saga recently ... Same thing. The 'tuck it in ' comments in the studio were inappropriate but I think it was a bit harsh to lose his job cos of it. In isolation it perhaps was just a stupid bit of banter but having already disciplined him his employer could not ignore it.
There is something that bothers me about all this and worries me in general about sexual innuendo between menand women in the workplace and it is this. How good are we at teaching our girls to stick up for themselves if whenever a dirty old man makes a smutty comment the answer is to report them for sexual harrassment and have someone else deal with it? Don't get me wrong ... Sexual harrassment is not acceptable . Lewd comments are neither funny nor appropriate but surely we should teach our girls to deal effectively with the low level stuff. Slapped face, ascerbic put downs and assertiveness can often be very effective in putting guys in their place. Often more so than a course on the subject. And by god, it makes you feel good. It's empowering to put a letch in their place and it puts you as a woman, in control.
If the harrassment is persistent or approaching indecent assault then of course it must be reported but really, girls, some letchy old footballer asking to have his mike tucked intohis trousers is not beyond a witty ascerbic put down that makes him think twice next time.
If you slap a man in the face for a lewd comment it is YOU who is likely to face the sack and perhaps an assault charge. It is OK to talk about the more mature woman to have the nous and experience to deal with a pest prone to innuendo but what about young girls new to a job? They are likely to be intimidated and perhaps even afraid to report the problem. I disagree that tolerating and learning to cope with the unacceptable is the correct way forward. Get the message out that such matters are against the terms of one's employment and that action will be taken to protect vulnerable employees makes more sense to me.
Women have fought long and hard to obtain basic rights in this country and it hasn't been in place long in the scheme of historical time scale. Do we try to move forward or just celebrate how wonderful it is that women can drive a car in this country!!
No as i am a woman i forget what the off side rule is until it is explained to me again!! ( it's my pea sized brain ) !!
What ever Andy Gray and Richard Keyes
said they didn't physically hurt her did they?
Name calling wasn't it?? Like i said sticks and stones!!!
Do you really believe that people who pay a fortune sometimes to see a match would sit there watching the lineswoman for the whole match?
Again i said she proved herself by making the right decision!
Let her do the job she obviously loves doing! As far as a wager goes i wouldn't want you to lose your money!!!!
Sticks and Stones is the biggest load of crap ever stated as a maxim.
I took my Son to see the Head Teacher of Wick South school when he was getting stress from other pupils. The remarks made were concerning my Wife having cerebral palsy and accusations of him having sexual intercourse with his seven year old Sister. Now you tell me in any sane way how those statements cannot and did not cause hurt? The head teacher asked my Son if he had ever heard about "Sticks and Stones will break my bones but names will never harm me" to which he replied that he had. She then went on to tell him that it was the biggest load of rubbish ever written and that insults DO hurt.
Not only do insults hurt, they don't go away in the way that a physical pain does. They can linger a lifetime for some people.
I would go on but I suspect I am flogging a dead horse here, since you are a woman after all ;)
No as i am a woman i forget what the off side rule is until it is explained to me again!! ( it's my pea sized brain ) !!
What ever Andy Gray and Richard Keyes
said they didn't physically hurt her did they?
Name calling wasn't it?? Like i said sticks and stones!!!
Do you really believe that people who pay a fortune sometimes to see a match would sit there watching the lineswoman for the whole match?
Again i said she proved herself by making the right decision!
Let her do the job she obviously loves doing! As far as a wager goes i wouldn't want you to lose your money!!!!
Nothing to do with name calling. They were questioning her professional ability - and at the same time suggesting that it was her gender which made her less able (in their eyes) to do her job. Simples.
If you slap a man in the face for a lewd comment it is YOU who is likely to face the sack and perhaps an assault charge. It is OK to talk about the more mature woman to have the nous and experience to deal with a pest prone to innuendo but what about young girls new to a job? They are likely to be intimidated and perhaps even afraid to report the problem. I disagree that tolerating and learning to cope with the unacceptable is the correct way forward. Get the message out that such matters are against the terms of one's employment and that action will be taken to protect vulnerable employees makes more sense to me.
Women have fought long and hard to obtain basic rights in this country and it hasn't been in place long in the scheme of historical time scale. Do we try to move forward or just celebrate how wonderful it is that women can drive a car in this country!!
You are talking about physical abuse now!
not comments made in a studio that weren't meant for our ears or Sian Masseys!! :confused Whether you are young or old, man or woman, give us all some credit for having the sense to know the difference between harmless comments and actual physical abuse!!
You are talking about physical abuse now!
not comments made in a studio that weren't meant for our ears or Sian Masseys!! :confused Whether you are young or old, man or woman, give us all some credit for having the sense to know the difference between harmless comments and actual physical abuse!!
No, I am referring to Squidge's post suggesting that a slap in the face was a good retort to a sexual innuendo from a pest. In Squidge's example it is the VICTIM of the comment who has raised their hand.
Do try to keep up.
Nothing to do with name calling. They were questioning her professional ability - and at the same time suggesting that it was her gender which made her less able (in their eyes) to do her job. Simples.
yes it is! What a couple of men said to each other about her!! It didn't prevent her proving the point that she did a good job! Like i said ?? many times now, she proved herself by going out there and getting it right!! ( In their eyes who cares) Go compare!
No, I am referring to Squidge's post suggesting that a slap in the face was a good retort to a sexual innuendo from a pest. In Squidge's example it is the VICTIM of the comment who has raised their hand.
Do try to keep up.
oh sorry it's a woman thing being slow!! :lol: The pea sized brain and all that! :lol:
;)
Sticks and Stones is the biggest load of crap ever stated as a maxim.
I took my Son to see the Head Teacher of Wick South school when he was getting stress from other pupils. The remarks made were concerning my Wife having cerebral palsy and accusations of him having sexual intercourse with his seven year old Sister. Now you tell me in any sane way how those statements cannot and did not cause hurt? The head teacher asked my Son if he had ever heard about "Sticks and Stones will break my bones but names will never harm me" to which he replied that he had. She then went on to tell him that it was the biggest load of rubbish ever written and that insults DO hurt.
Not only do insults hurt, they don't go away in the way that a physical pain does. They can linger a lifetime for some people.
I would go on but I suspect I am flogging a dead horse here, since you are a woman after all ;)
neigh, neigh we are getting peronal!
My dad had polio,no formal schooling as children with polio were treated like lepers!
My mother had no schooling as when her mother gave birth to twins she had a stroke and was left paralysed and needed my mum to help her!
Yes some comments may hurt i've had loads thrown my way ( your dads a spastic ladidah! ) but my family explained that people can be cruel, they taught me to be strong and of course when you are talking of children your in a diiferent territory anyway!
We are however talking of a 25 year old woman ( teacher ) i believe! Sian Massey!
not your son or my family!
As far as me being likened to a dead horse fair play, you are probably right! :(
Scorrie you are right in some ways. Mature women should have the nous to deal with a sex pest but we should be passing that on to our daughters. Of course the law is there to protect women and it has been hard won but we still should be teaching our girls to stand up for themselves and put lewd and unpleasant men in their place. Not instead of giving them the right to redress through the law but as well as.
To take some of the other points on this thread, names ARE hurtful and bullying of any type must not be tolerated. If sexist smutty comments really offend and lead to a feeling of vulnerability then action must be taken.
I do think though that comparing what andy Gray and Richard keys said to jo brand and loose women is not comparing like for like. Comments made in the workplace are made in a professional arena, whether they are meant to be heard or not. During the time you are working you are representing your employer ... Sky tv for example.... And what you say reflects on them. If you go to see Jo brand or watch her show you do so expecting her to tell jokes or stories that are close to the edge of what's acceptable. It's like watching a character in a sitcom make smutty comments... It's different than watching two professional football pundits make disparaging remarks about another professional.
Finally they should both have been sacked for being stupid.
Perhaps the slightly odd part of the whole incident is they were recorded off air, and then the recording was leaked by back room staff so I suppose the whole debate is, in a round about way, focussing on the fact that they have an opinion (to which they are entitled) that a large amount of people don't agree with. The fact that they work in the job they do still entitles them to an opinion doesnt it?
The people that do agree with Gray's opinion will save it till the boozer on match day probably and there is absolutely nothing all anyone can do about that. It is their opinion..
Is there a boundary? Of course there is. Would they say it to her? I doubt it very much.
I would rather people have differing opinions, even if they are opinions I do not agree with..
So there.
Sorry but didnt you post a few posts back that women were probably better than the men at being linesmen/referees ??, So how exactly does that make you any different to the view you take of them ??, Andy Gray was sacked, amongst other things for saying that women didnt know the offside rule, something you call him sexist for. Yet you have done the same by stating that women are probably better then men at the job. What exactly is the difference between the implication of what Andy Gray said and what you said ??
Football ran fine without female officials, thereby making your comment look not only sexist but daft as well. Or are you one of these people that think sexism is just something that men indulge in. Because go turn on Loose Women or Jo Brand as two examples of blatant sexism towards men ON AIR and yet nothing is done. Why is that exactly ??, is it because of people like you who apply one standard to one gender and another to the opposite ?? .. Survey says .. UH .. UH. Personally I am sick of people like you who hide behind their own double standards. Your the type who would, and in fact just have, quite willingly make a comment along the lines of what you said in the quote above but if the same were directed at you would be the first to whinge bitch and moan.
So Andy Gray said women dont know the offside rule .. you know what most of the women I know dont !!, so he made a jibe at a female presenter ??, big deal. I have had worse said to me by women on more than one occasion (I worked in a section once where I had six girls working for me) but you dont see me making a big issue about it and anyone who has seen a group of women at a Chippendales night will see the blatant hypocrisy in women claiming the high ground on sexism every time it suits. Both sexes do it, trouble is in todays society you can only get away with it if your female. I am sure though that Andy Gray, a pundit I dont particularly like to be honest, gives a toss what the likes of you and Scorrie thinks. Scorrie probably thinks he pays his wages through his licence fee .. you dont in case you were wondering.
All this is is the usual dullards who jump to the medias tune. The type that cant wait to jump on the outrage bus, predictable and sad.
You seem to have lost the plot there DD...we are all entitled to an opinion. They made theirs and lost their jobs for it, I made my opinion and got called a double standard Dullard. I wonder what your opinion will cost you???....It seems like we all have a price to pay for making an opinion these days, thing is DD, I dont mind being called a few names, it doesnt hurt me in my pocket and thats all that counts!!
C3..... :-)
;)
neigh, neigh we are getting peronal!
My dad had polio,no formal schooling as children with polio were treated like lepers!
My mother had no schooling as when her mother gave birth to twins she had a stroke and was left paralysed and needed my mum to help her!
Yes some comments may hurt i've had loads thrown my way ( your dads a spastic ladidah! ) but my family explained that people can be cruel, they taught me to be strong and of course when you are talking of children your in a diiferent territory anyway!
We are however talking of a 25 year old woman ( teacher ) i believe! Sian Massey!
not your son or my family!
As far as me being likened to a dead horse fair play, you are probably right! :(
People don't become immune to hurt just because they reach the age of 25. As we grow older we learn to cope better but that doesn't mean that you become impervious to being hurt by what is said.
Take any woman of any age and I can almost guarantee that they would be hurt by someone saying that they were unattractive, particularly someone more than twice their age. Likewise for anyone being told, by someone who has not seen their work, that they are incapable of doing their job right.
I'm done with this thread now. I have said all I need to in order to offer MY opinion. The question is a moot point anyway, since Andy Gray WAS sacked and support for him from this forum will not change that fact.
The Pepsi Challenge
31-Jan-11, 03:11
Perhaps female English assistant referees could come up to Scotland and explain the offside rule to their Scottish counterparts, who are clearly unsure what it means themselves.
Perhaps female English assistant referees could come up to Scotland and explain the offside rule to their Scottish counterparts, who are clearly unsure what it means themselves.
Only when all that ironings finished.
Only when all that ironings finished.
At last some people with a sense of humour!!!
Harmless bit of fun!
No people where hurt in the posting of your comment!!
It made me laugh, thanks!!! :lol:
People don't become immune to hurt just because they reach the age of 25. As we grow older we learn to cope better but that doesn't mean that you become impervious to being hurt by what is said.
Take any woman of any age and I can almost guarantee that they would be hurt by someone saying that they were unattractive, particularly someone more than twice their age. Likewise for anyone being told, by someone who has not seen their work, that they are incapable of doing their job right.
I'm done with this thread now. I have said all I need to in order to offer MY opinion. The question is a moot point anyway, since Andy Gray WAS sacked and support for him from this forum will not change that fact.
Oh and because i don't agree with everything you say you've spat your dummy??
Why don't you wrap yourself up in cotton wool!
Don't expect everyone to do the same!!
I haven't said that what Gray and Keyes was right!
I did say, they made what they thought was a private bit of banter between two mates!
Someone thought lets grass them up like the playground snitch!
I don't care what they said!
Sian Massey proved them wrong in good style!
who feels stupid??
I hope they don't wrap her up in cotton wool and keep pulling her out of matches for every little excuse!!
The Drunken Duck
31-Jan-11, 15:22
What makes you think football cannot run fine WITH female officials? I don't see any law stating that they cannot enter the profession.
How many of your female friends are assistant referees? Remember Andy's statement covered ALL, not SOME, women.
Getting a bit personal now are we? Andy Gray doesn't know me or give a toss about what I say. How does this relate to me putting MY opinion on a PUBLIC forum? Every single thing put on this forum could be condemned as "Insert relevant name...doesn't give a toss"
If Loose Women bothers you so much then make a complaint. If they gave me any gyp I would simply refer to them as "Slack Slappers" rather than Loose Women ;)
People are putting their opinions here, no need to be calling anyone dullards, it simply undermines your credibility.
Dear god .. do you read what is written ?? .. try it. It might help you to see the point I was making and respond instead of ignoring it and finding an imaginary slight to get upset about. All you did was ignore the bits that you didnt like, pick one up you did and made one up to fill out the post.
I never said women couldn't be refeeres, that right there is an assumption you have jumped to. I dont care if they are or not, if anyone meets the standard then they should be eligible in my view. My point was that you are getting on your high horse about Andy Gray making a comment, as you say, about all women. Something you apprently dont like. But you are quite happy to make blanket comments that women are probably better referres than men. All men. So basically you are berating him for something you are doing yourself !!, in my book that makes a bit of a hypocrite. That was my point.
Lets face it your opinons and Andy's have a bit in common, they are just 180 degrees from each other. And I stand by my dullards remark. Watching people jump on the media bandwagon about those off air comments while ignoring far worse on air ones just shows them up for the sheep they are. A blind man in a snowstorm could see that the fact his own employer released those tapes means there is far more to this story than meets the eye. Maybe they were banking on the unwashed gullible types jumping on the bandwagon and demanding his sacking rather then them just doing it outright ??
And I wont bother complaining about Loose Women. I raised the comparison to show the hypocrisy in the media (see !! them again) about sexism. Namely that it seems to be accpetable as long as it is directed solely at men. I really dont care what they think. I just find the "lets get outraged" mob funny.
Yes scorrie you also said we were all entitled to our opinion!
That's all Gray and Keyes did!
They thought the opinions they were sharing were private!
And debimac that would have been fine in their own front room or in the pub even, but to have that conversation at work ...a conversation which is entirely at odds with the public face of football which promotes equality and stands against discrimination was utterly utterly stupid and, even if it had not been leaked they should have been disciplined for behaving in a manner which brings their employer into disrepute.
I think you will find in most companies that's a disciplinary offence.
A mountain out of a mole hill!
For whose benefit?
I feel more sorry for the person who decided to leak the recording in the first place!
Sian Massey has a new nickname.........."Just For Men", use her once and the GRAY is gone forever! :lol::lol::lol:
Dear god .. do you read what is written ?? .. try it.
Sorry, Old Duckling but I don't believe in quoting posts endlessly and aswering every minute detail. I try to stick to what I see as relevant.
You really need to take your own advice and read what is written and VERY carefully at that.
I am putting my opinion forward here and being labelled a dullard by you for it. I will back my intellect against yours anytime pal. You accuse me of being on a high horse and then fail to see the hypocrisy in you labelling others as dullards.
Well, Mr High Horse, you had better start to work more carefully, because you have the cheek to have a rant about me making a blanket statement about women making better referees than men. I NEVER made such a statement. I would have expected a non-dullard to have realised that Corrie3 had made that statement.
This thread asked for opinions on Andy Gray's sacking, not for a moan about media, bandwagon, dullards etc ad nauseum tittle tattle that is as predictable on any forum as the "unwashed, gullible types" you so despise.
Calling people names does not improve your arguement. If you could crawl down from up your own outgoing passage for a while, you might see that.
Sober up duckie and get YOUR facts straight.
Sure enough Scorrie it was me who said that Women would probably make better Ref's than Men.....sorry if you got the blame for it. It does prove that DD doesnt read the posts properly though!!!
I said that because Women are well known to pay more attention to detail, tend to be more accurate and have a better eye than Men do !!
But as been said, this thread is pointless cos they have both gone and nothing that is said on here will alter things, no doubt they will go on to get just as well paid jobs with some other organisation, their type always do dont they?
Anyway, I quite like being called a Dullard, I would sooner have that than any name with drunk or drunkard in it!!!.....;)
C3.....:roll::cool:
Sticks and Stones is the biggest load of crap ever stated as a maxim.
I took my Son to see the Head Teacher of Wick South school when he was getting stress from other pupils. The remarks made were concerning my Wife having cerebral palsy and accusations of him having sexual intercourse with his seven year old Sister. Now you tell me in any sane way how those statements cannot and did not cause hurt? The head teacher asked my Son if he had ever heard about "Sticks and Stones will break my bones but names will never harm me" to which he replied that he had. She then went on to tell him that it was the biggest load of rubbish ever written and that insults DO hurt.
Not only do insults hurt, they don't go away in the way that a physical pain does. They can linger a lifetime for some people.
I would go on but I suspect I am flogging a dead horse here, since you are a woman after all ;)
Oh name calling! Let me see didn't you imply i was thick because i don't go along with everything you say?
Isn't that what flogging a dead horse means?
Since i am a woman after all!!
You have actually been more rude to me on here directly, than what Gray and Keyes did indirectly ( as someone snitched )
Well,well double standards!
You didn't keep it impersonal as you brought up the fact your son had been bullied, Richard Keyes has hairy hands???
I didn't say i agreed with what was said quite the opposite! I did say ignore it! Sian Massey proved herself as a linesperson!!
We were asked if we thought they should be sacked for their off air comments and i stand by what i think! No!
If you took the time to read things properly too that would be half the battle!!!
Isn't that what flogging a dead horse means?
Since i am a woman after all!!
Dear, Dear...Didn't you notice the wink/smile icon at the end of the line?
This is employed to indicate that the comment is ironic/light-hearted. It happens frequently on this forum and most people know and understand its usage. I apologise if you took/are taking it literally.
I am not interested in further discourse with you regarding this topic. You are simply repeating the same thing over and over again. I have read it thoroughly and there is little substance to it other than you feel they caused no harm. You have your opinion and are well within your right to hold that opinion.
Having read your claim that the comments that Gray and Keys made are nothing to make a fuss over and that they wouldn't bother you (sticks and stones etc) I find it hard to square the circle in regards to the strong and repetitive posts you have placed on this thread. This has culminated in a wee rant accusing me of name calling. That hardly sits easily with the profile of being laid back regarding such comments!! Something doesn't add up
Regarding personal/impersonal, I am talking about members of the org interacting. I can hardly relate a story about my Son without referring to him. Followers of football related programmes from the early nineties will know that Richard Keys was famous for having hairy hands. On Fantasy Football, David Baddiel and Frank Skinner had a skit where they stated that Richard Keys was to guest on the following week's programme, the photo of Keys was replaced with that of Galen (Roddy MacDowell) from Planet of the Apes. That is part of TV history, I didn't start it or take any part in it, it is simply the only thing a I recall about Richard Keys from his early days on Sky.
You are clutching at straws to keep rolling out your message. I understand your viewpoint, I just happen to disagree with it. Now feel free to have the last word, as I don't do brick wall conversations. ;) (wee smiley/wink mannie thingie)
Just thought I'd stick my oar in. I've read through all the posts and find it amusing that this subject has caused so much upset. For what? Two guys intimating that a female can't understand the offside rule.. I mean...come on, this has gone on for years and quite frankly. How simple is the offside rule?? It's not rocket science :D
Just thought I'd stick my oar in. I've read through all the posts and find it amusing that this subject has caused so much upset. For what? Two guys intimating that a female can't understand the offside rule.. I mean...come on, this has gone on for years and quite frankly. How simple is the offside rule?? It's not rocket science :D
See Offside for Women in the Sports section.
I mean...come on, this has gone on for years and quite frankly. How simple is the offside rule?? It's not rocket science :D
You want me to explain the offside rule?
Offside: A woman who has crossed the boundary of a kitchen
I mean, none of this trouble would ever have started if she stayed in the kitchen.
Come on guys (and gals) its political correctness gone mad, what next?
No more sexism, then they will move on to ageism, racism, religionism, heterosexism, ableism, antisemitism, atheism. We have to stop it before they take away all subjects of comedy.
You want me to explain the offside rule?
Offside: A woman who has crossed the boundary of a kitchen
I mean, none of this trouble would ever have started if she stayed in the kitchen.
Come on guys (and gals) its political correctness gone mad, what next?
No more sexism, then they will move on to ageism, racism, religionism, heterosexism, ableism, antisemitism, atheism. We have to stop it before they take away all subjects of comedy.
A very Logical view and one I've got to agree with. Everybody is walking around on tiptoes petrified of speaking their mind nowadays. I'm all for good manners but everyone has a personal opinion which they should be at liberty to voice in private. As I've said previously Andy Gray's sacking means little to me but the gagging orders which abound in our 'democratic' society worry me.
You want me to explain the offside rule?
Offside: A woman who has crossed the boundary of a kitchen
I mean, none of this trouble would ever have started if she stayed in the kitchen.
Come on guys (and gals) its political correctness gone mad, what next?
No more sexism, then they will move on to ageism, racism, religionism, heterosexism, ableism, antisemitism, atheism. We have to stop it before they take away all subjects of comedy.
That has been my point all the way through!
Some of us like to laugh and take life not so seriously!
Life without laughter, no thanks!
Now I get your off side rule! my husband tells me that one on a regular basis!
What I say to him is unrepeatable on here but I can take the joke and dish it out equally!
Just thought I'd stick my oar in. I've read through all the posts and find it amusing that this subject has caused so much upset. For what? Two guys intimating that a female can't understand the offside rule.. I mean...come on, this has gone on for years and quite frankly. How simple is the offside rule?? It's not rocket science :D
Exactly!
Now to the off side rule explain to me again?? HaHa :lol:
Dear, Dear...Didn't you notice the wink/smile icon at the end of the line?
This is employed to indicate that the comment is ironic/light-hearted. It happens frequently on this forum and most people know and understand its usage. I apologise if you took/are taking it literally.
I am not interested in further discourse with you regarding this topic. You are simply repeating the same thing over and over again. I have read it thoroughly and there is little substance to it other than you feel they caused no harm. You have your opinion and are well within your right to hold that opinion.
Having read your claim that the comments that Gray and Keys made are nothing to make a fuss over and that they wouldn't bother you (sticks and stones etc) I find it hard to square the circle in regards to the strong and repetitive posts you have placed on this thread. This has culminated in a wee rant accusing me of name calling. That hardly sits easily with the profile of being laid back regarding such comments!! Something doesn't add up
Regarding personal/impersonal, I am talking about members of the org interacting. I can hardly relate a story about my Son without referring to him. Followers of football related programmes from the early nineties will know that Richard Keys was famous for having hairy hands. On Fantasy Football, David Baddiel and Frank Skinner had a skit where they stated that Richard Keys was to guest on the following week's programme, the photo of Keys was replaced with that of Galen (Roddy MacDowell) from Planet of the Apes. That is part of TV history, I didn't start it or take any part in it, it is simply the only thing a I recall about Richard Keys from his early days on Sky.
You are clutching at straws to keep rolling out your message. I understand your viewpoint, I just happen to disagree with it. Now feel free to have the last word, as I don't do brick wall conversations. ;) (wee smiley/wink mannie thingie)
Some of us need to repeat ourselves to be heard!!
There was me thinking that ;) smiley meant you had something in your eye!
Dear oh dear have you lost your sense of humour?? :lol: ( that means you make me laugh ) just in case you didn't know!!!
Green_not_greed
02-Feb-11, 13:11
Well I don't think Andy Gray will be that worried now. I heard he's just landed another TV football commentators job.
On Al Jazeera. ;)
To remove the need to be pc or walk on eggshells is easy, treat others as you would wish to be treated. I was brought up to believe that is is wrong to denigrate or laugh at anyone because of their religion, race, sexuality or personal circumstance. Those with real humour and confidence laugh at themselves, not belittle or verbally attack those whom the feel superior to and when challenged on their behaviour whine and moan about everyone being too pc and having no sense of humour.
That may be so, but in my book if you can laugh at yourself and you dont mind others laughing at you, thar gives you the right to laugh at them.
If I laugh at myself and invite others to laugh with me that is humour and fun that harms no one. What does that have to do with denigrating and verbally attacking others?
If I laugh at myself and invite others to laugh with me that is humour and fun that harms no one. What does that have to do with denigrating and verbally attacking others?
Read the end bit of your first sentence on post#76.
Walter Ego
02-Feb-11, 23:41
Gray is a complete arse IMO.
But ti's all irelevant as fitba is a game for poofs and morons.
"treat others as you would wish to be treated! Oh dear my apologies. you are a member of a minority group that enjoys being verbally abused and denigrated. Be aware that this is very much a minority within society but enjoy yourself in your own way but no need to assume that others have the same inclinations.
I sometimes wonder what people are allowed to laugh at these days without being linched!
"treat others as you would wish to be treated! Oh dear my apologies. you are a member of a minority group that enjoys being verbally abused and denigrated. Be aware that this is very much a minority within society but enjoy yourself in your own way but no need to assume that others have the same inclinations.
Who is that directed at? :confused
Originally Posted by Kitcat
If I laugh at myself and invite others to laugh with me that is humour and fun that harms no one. What does that have to do with denigrating and verbally attacking others?
Read the end bit of your first sentence on post#76.
This was the post I replied to.
Thanks i'm easily confused! :)
Lol you are female, you have an excuse [lol]
Thanks i'm easily confused! :)
Sorry I have that effect on people lol
Innit just!
It's probably hormones! Haha :lol:
Or the blonde hair ( which comes out of a bottle )
Just as well tenna ladies were invented!! :lol:
Sorry I have that effect on people lol
Me too! :lol:
Oh well that did not take long: "Andy gray and Richard Keys have made their radio debut, following the Sky Sports sexism row. The pair, who will present a regular show on talkSPORT, appeared briefly on Alan Brazil's breakfast show before hosting their own spot between 10am and 1pm."
(virginmedia)
I saw yesterday that Keys is now being accused of racism after calling a black Nottm Forest player a "Choc Jock" in connection with the players eligibilty to play for Scotland !!!
Mind you, this happened 11 years ago and was again supposed to be "off air".
C3....:eek::roll:;)
11 years ago? Does seem to be a witch hunt against him, what next an old classmate revealing what he said in the playground 40 years ago. Notice as well none of the press have suggested the word jock is racist, or is it only ethnics can be offended these days.
fingalmacool
14-Feb-11, 23:59
I for the life of me haven't read 5% of this dribble, why why why why why is it still going, Sky wanted shot of them, good god people move on they have:confused
Stan Colleymore, ex Liverpool centre forward does a bit for Talk Radio and he gets about 300 grand a year. Good work if you can get it.
Invisible
15-Feb-11, 14:24
No...............next question
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