Famous Castletown Employer

[Catharnach74]

Over and over, you see a "Famous Castletown Employer" treat their employees worse than dog poo, and then dare to complain about employees bad attitudes. Because somehow, even though this employer treats you like you're more trouble than you're worth, will throw you out with the trash at the first opportunity, somehow, you're still supposed to be blindly loyal to them. You're supposed to care more about the company than you do about yourself. You're supposed to sacrifice your dignity, your self-worth, everything, to pump up the profits of a company that will knock your pride and self-esteem in the dirt if it means they get an extra pound in the executive bonuses. It gets even worst at this "Famous Castletown Employer" I've heard, like this example getting time off work when orders have dried up then owing hours to the company and being forced to work overtime to pay the hours back when orders do eventually pick up, I reckon this is manipulation of the workforce and contradicts conditions of employment set down by law.

[arat]

been their dun it and worn the t shirt

[unicorn]

Very much so, owing over 100 hours and 2 parents working there and being forced to work hours which mean you never see your child because they had no work and chose to close Mondays, I remember the days of being stressed and angry because I wanted to spend time with my child and trying to explain that as both parents worked there it was totally unfair and I remember the whole attitude of well that's tough.
I was told at my interview when I asked about this situation that I would not be put in this situation, well they lied.
I never understood how they got off with it.

[RecQuery]

I suspect most businesses above a certain size are like this now, with a sort of mystique built up that executives deserve those bonuses because they're skilled, that's crap they're not skilled just lucky.

This is sort of related http://www.bynkii.com/archives/2009/11/on_employee_loyalty.html i hate when some employers complain about loyalty.

[Logical]

So much talking between the lines...

Which company is it?

[Tubthumper]

I think that some 'famous local companies' develop dim but long serving yes-men (and women) into supervisors and managers without considering any personality flaws they have. Give it power, a fancy name and as much polish as you like but it's still a turd underneath.

And they make sure the workforce is kept under the thumb and in the dark (even about health & safety issues!) so no-one is ever sure about their rights or the law. Even something like music while you work becomes another way to turn the screw!

But (apparently) you should be thankful you have a job at all in these uncertain times. Why not speak to your Shop Steward or the Human Resources/ Personnel Manager? They won't sack you for asking simple questions, will they?

[Tubthumper]

I never understood how they got off with it.
They've got away with quite a lot over the years, haven't they?

[unicorn]

Very true, but I suppose had I not worked there in a spot where the rain was dripping down on me every time it rained, freezing my bits off working with gloves on, 2 jumpers, t-shirt, tights, leggings, trousers and as many pairs of socks as my doc martins would allow, then I may never have taken the leap to become self employed, so thats one benefit I suppose. [lol]

[Catharnach74]

I think that some 'famous local companies' develop dim but long serving yes-men (and women) into supervisors and managers without considering any personality flaws they have. Give it power, a fancy name and as much polish as you like but it's still a turd underneath.

And they make sure the workforce is kept under the thumb and in the dark (even about health & safety issues!) so no-one is ever sure about their rights or the law. Even something like music while you work becomes another way to turn the screw!

But (apparently) you should be thankful you have a job at all in these uncertain times. Why not speak to your Shop Steward or the Human Resources/ Personnel Manager? They won't sack you for asking simple questions, will they?

According to what I know Union, Shop Steward is non existent there, people who have tried to get a Union in have been forced to leave or sacked, and for the Human Resources/ Personnel Manager the person in that position I've heard apparently come under the dim yes men/women with those personality flaws title.

[theone]

According to what I know Union, Shop Steward is non existent there, people who have tried to get a Union in have been forced to leave or sacked, and for the Human Resources/ Personnel Manager the person in that position I've heard apparently come under the dim yes men/women with those personality flaws title.

I'm an ex union member and will never join again.

The "unions" are good only up to the shop steward level in my experience. Everyone above that is only interested in their own wellbeing.

I admire the shop stewards but they are fighting a losing battle.

I remember seeing the union rep driving on to site in his 7 series BMW, walking straight past the workers (his employers) and having ground coffee, handshakes and back slaps with the company men.

The unions are powerless in my opinion, and a waste of money to those who need them.

[ducati]

If you feel downtrodden or put upon by your employer or manager, it is often because they are better at influencing you, than you are them.

Good managers are good influencers (amongst other things)

Influence is a skill or a set of tools that can be learned and can be very powerful. This is not the usual mumbo jumbo we get on this site, it is proven and it works in business, work AND life.

If you interested in becoming more influential a good place to start is Robert Cialdini. There are some good snippets here:

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Robert+Cialdini&hl=en&rlz=1T4GGLR_enGB310GB310&prmd=vibo&source=univ&tbs=vid:1&tbo=u&ei=SJ7fTNVZg7eFB-3esa0N&sa=X&oi=video_result_group&ct=title&resnum=4&ved=0CE4QqwQwAw

[annemarie482]

if you still work for this company......
i'd tread very carefully.
from personal knowledge, i know (from what you've already written) you've said enough that you can be sacked for Defamation, or damage to the companies reputation despite not mentioning the company name or the persons involved even though you identity is hidden.
unfortuately freedom of speach does not apply on such networks :(

[EDDIE]

The thing is there is not a lot of work in caithness so if you have a job even if its crap at least your bringing in a wage its a lot better than sitting at home doing zero

[Logical]

The thing is there is not a lot of work in caithness so if you have a job even if its crap at least your bringing in a wage its a lot better than sitting at home doing zero

What about the dole?

[Tubthumper]

from personal knowledge, i know (from what you've already written) you've said enough that you can be sacked for Defamation, or damage to the companies reputation despite not mentioning the company name or the persons involved even though you identity is hidden.

I must have missed something, what did catharnach say that could be construed by the company as defamation?

[annemarie482]

http://www.articlesbase.com/law-articles/defamation-and-slander-on-the-internet-96191.html

is a wee bit of info on defamtion.
maybe defamtion isn't quite the right word im looking for. i dont know.

the whole post slags the company and the way they treat their staff.
which doesnt encouarge folk to work there or think very highly of the company.
i'm not out for a fight or arguement:roll:
but having been stung myself for something very very similar, i'd hate for someone else to get in trouble also.

[EDDIE]

http://www.articlesbase.com/law-articles/defamation-and-slander-on-the-internet-96191.html

is a wee bit of info on defamtion.
maybe defamtion isn't quite the right word im looking for. i dont know.

the whole post slags the company and the way they treat their staff.
which doesnt encouarge folk to work there or think very highly of the company.
i'm not out for a fight or arguement:roll:
but having been stung myself for something very very similar, i'd hate for someone else to get in trouble also.

If you get a supervisor or manager that is a bit of a you no what with no people handling skills it does have a knock on effect on the rest of the employess the same as if you get a boss that is nice personality in general it makes a huge difference in the work atmosphere thats why its important that you get the right quality of person in charge

[EDDIE]

What about the dole?

Your better working than being unemployed even if in some cases your better of with benifts

[annemarie482]

If you get a supervisor or manager that is a bit of a you no what with no people handling skills it does have a knock on effect on the rest of the employess the same as if you get a boss that is nice personality in general it makes a huge difference in the work atmosphere thats why its important that you get the right quality of person in charge

totally agree!! i can relate to how the op feels too!! [evil] lol

[Tubthumper]

i'm not out for a fight or arguement:roll:
but having been stung myself for something very very similar, i'd hate for someone else to get in trouble also.
Nae bother, me neither. A man (or woman) feeling a bit low and having a pop at their employer, sad that it could end up as a big thing. But I can understand some companies are very sensitive of their good reputation. Others are more inclined to want it kept quiet, for whatever reason.

[achingale]

Contracts are the key. Make sure you read your contract carefully, and remember they are negotiable. Owing hours may be in it - if not, it cannot be enforced. Put any complaints in writing but only as a last resort. Talk to the company. Speak to others who work there. Keep a diary even. If they 'make you redundant' with the reason being lack of work, they cannot instantly hire someone else. This is against the law and you can take them to a tribunal or court. It is horrible to be in such a situation and I can symapthise.

[RecQuery]

Contracts are the key. Make sure you read your contract carefully, and remember they are negotiable. Owing hours may be in it - if not, it cannot be enforced. Put any complaints in writing but only as a last resort. Talk to the company. Speak to others who work there. Keep a diary even. If they 'make you redundant' with the reason being lack of work, they cannot instantly hire someone else. This is against the law and you can take them to a tribunal or court. It is horrible to be in such a situation and I can symapthise.

That's what to do in theory but I've heard of a few employers and even worked for one who just ignore contracts, only use them to backup their points or completely change them when it suits them. I've known a few people who have tried arbitration, filing disputes and all that, but they usually lose.

I've never experienced it personally but the system seems stacked against employees, regardless of the letter of regulations it's about what actually happens.

[achingale]

That's what to do in theory but I've heard of a few employers and even worked for one who just ignore contracts, only use them to backup their points or completely change them when it suits them. I've known a few people who have tried arbitration, filing disputes and all that, but they usually lose.

I've never experienced it personally but the system seems stacked against employees, regardless of the letter of regulations it's about what actually happens.

You are right - that is the law but sometimes contracts are ignored or not even written down, which you are entitled to get after 12 weeks I think it is. The law does favour the employer and not the employee. I know someone who had a contract and when the company wanted to get rid of him/her they made their life hell. But they get away with it time and again. It is very unfair.

[orkneycadian]

The law does favour the employer and not the employee.

[lol]

Now your jesting, surely?

Employment law favours employees many times more so than it does employers!

[Amy-Winehouse]

Over and over, you see a "Famous Castletown Employer" treat their employees worse than dog poo, and then dare to complain about employees bad attitudes. Because somehow, even though this employer treats you like you're more trouble than you're worth, will throw you out with the trash at the first opportunity, somehow, you're still supposed to be blindly loyal to them. You're supposed to care more about the company than you do about yourself. You're supposed to sacrifice your dignity, your self-worth, everything, to pump up the profits of a company that will knock your pride and self-esteem in the dirt if it means they get an extra pound in the executive bonuses. It gets even worst at this "Famous Castletown Employer" I've heard, like this example getting time off work when orders have dried up then owing hours to the company and being forced to work overtime to pay the hours back when orders do eventually pick up, I reckon this is manipulation of the workforce and contradicts conditions of employment set down by law.

Ive luckilly never worked there but I do remember asking 1 chap , why dont you go to the Union rep about the crap treatment only to be told that the boss was the Union rep!!!!!!!!!:eek:[evil]
I found that to be absolutely unbelievable , just totally defeating the purpose , a kind of "Its my ball so if ye dont let me kick it the most Im gona set the big boys on ye & I ken ye need this job but Im important yer not" attitude.

100% delighted I didnt end up in that hellhole

[chr15]

worked there 7 yrs and i know how you feel. at the time i was employed there we were very busy, good bonus, job security etc. sadly the one thing that let the place down was the supervisors who were a law unto themselves, rude crude and downright ignorant(and that was just the female ones!!) and i believe their still there throwing their weight about.

[tomcat]

Do you know what i am all for freedom of speech but i think you have done enough now when you look at the situation we all have rights as human beings but unfortunately people have to work and as we all no life as it is is full of up and downs. The problem is you get out of life what you want and if people are going to allow themselfs to be treated like this them the ither put up or shut up or get another job. But lets not forget that alot of people would love nothing better than to get up in the morning and go to a good job with lots of perks like sitting behind a besk all day and doing next to nothing and getting top doller for it well lets just say there are not enough of these jobs going and what with the good companys going into liquidation there is a lot to be said about having a job even as bad as this one if we have read this post right. I dont know about anybody else out there but it would be a cold day in hell before i would go along to the dole and as for ther hand out everyfortnight but that is just me well i think that i am finisned my rant no wait a minute some of you folk need to grow a pair and just get on with life and stop b----ing about it and i not wanting an argument here but you aint half been childish

[Better Out Than In]

Unfortunately you do need to be careful - when in a situation where jobs are short then the employer has a lot of power.

Employees, other than through tribunal, usually need to have collective power - so it is in the interests of certain employers to avoid that situation. Hindering the formation of union membership and representation, getting rid of any "trouble makers" etc.

All employment law is about protection of the employee. There are other laws that protect employers. But you do need to know how to use it. You need to be clear on what your rights are and collect recordable evidence as events occur - you really need to collect signed witness statements at the time - and as much written evidence as possible. A detailed diary, possible signed at intervals by an independent person (to prove it was not back entries) is also important. If you do aim for a tribunal then the process you use to prepare your case is just as important as the case itself - the law requires procedures to be followed.

It is true that some contracts of employment allow for employers to send staff home on full pay and then recover those hours later - but it is not an automatic right and will depend on various conditions

I am a bit hazy on employment contracts as I have seen many examples where these have been re-written without necessarily individuals having to agree. Guessing it would depend on what was changed, how your rights were affected and whether you had agreed to collective bargaining - in which case the union rep overides individuals perhaps. May be it is just that if you do not object as an individual then it becomes custom and practice after a period.

To remove an employee by making them redundant and then replacing them is illigal in Scotland - constructive dismissal or similar (depends on circumstances)

It is also illigal to bully employees at work - whether your a supervisor or not. There is also other civil laws protecting individual rights - at work and outside. The citizen advice bureau may help with advice.

Some union conveners are very helpful and most unions will provide sound employment advice to their members. A convener however is not necessarily anti-management and will be interested in keeping their members in sound employment.

It is not in the interest of employers to mishandle their employees to the point where productivity is affected. This is where collective bargaining pays. Start to hit them in their wallet. But this can back fire and they could simple set up production somewhere else.

That is why employees should not misuse collective bargaining - your employers may be competing against cheap foreign imports in a cut throat market and you could end up being the straw that broke the camel's back.

So in my ideal little world the employers and employees work together for mutual benefit.

In most Scandinavian countries the company board must include union representatives not just employers.

Sorry to preach on.

[scorrie]

Information about contract changes:-

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/EmploymentContractsAndConditions/DG_10028079

[mrlennie]

Do you know what i am all for freedom of speech but i think you have done enough now when you look at the situation we all have rights as human beings but unfortunately people have to work and as we all no life as it is is full of up and downs. The problem is you get out of life what you want and if people are going to allow themselfs to be treated like this them the ither put up or shut up or get another job. But lets not forget that alot of people would love nothing better than to get up in the morning and go to a good job with lots of perks like sitting behind a besk all day and doing next to nothing and getting top doller for it well lets just say there are not enough of these jobs going and what with the good companys going into liquidation there is a lot to be said about having a job even as bad as this one if we have read this post right. I dont know about anybody else out there but it would be a cold day in hell before i would go along to the dole and as for ther hand out everyfortnight but that is just me well i think that i am finisned my rant no wait a minute some of you folk need to grow a pair and just get on with life and stop b----ing about it and i not wanting an argument here but you aint half been childish

Ouch someone has the proverbial tatty on the shoulder...