View Full Version : Pregnant mums to be paid to quit smoking
I am at a loss re the following article on GRAMPIAN news.
Pregnant mums who smoke in Tayside are being offered a range of incentives to kick the habit.
A new scheme will offer them incentives worth up to £50 a month if they
NHS Tayside is denying that the incentives are merely bribes.
quit.
Lead Pharmacist of NHS Tayside Andrew Radley said: "It's been proven that only six to eight per cent of people manage to stop smoking even with help, so to try and stop without any help is an uphill struggle. We hope that these incentives plus the social support and the opportunity for them to get nicotine replacement therapy from their local chemist they will stand a bigger chance of kicking the habit for good.
"We're offering things like vouchers for them to buy fresh fruit and vegetables, free entry into fitness and leisure facilities and classes in relaxation and stress management. These things will improve the lives of the women who take part in it.
NHS Tayside will offer them a range of incentives valued at up to £50 a month things like grocery vouchers, access to leisure centres, creche facilites and stress and relaxation classes.
if they dont stop smoking for the sake of their babies health i dont think they ever will.Its one of the worst things i see is a pregnant woman with a fag hanging out their mouths.
connieb19
28-Jun-06, 23:26
if they dont stop smoking for the sake of their babies health i dont think they ever will.Its one of the worst things i see is a pregnant woman with a fag hanging out their mouths.Exactly, it's disgusting. Another thing is people driving about with a car load of kids and smoking in the car!![disgust]
some people dont know how lucky they are to have healthy babies.I know what like it is to have one thats been poorly and i never smoked or took drink or drugs when pregnant or any other time for that matter.
I think seeing anybody smoking is disgusting. But if they are willing to subsidise the NHS then so be it.;)
if they dont stop smoking for the sake of their babies health i dont think they ever will.Its one of the worst things i see is a pregnant woman with a fag hanging out their mouths.
I agree, in fact they should be penilised for smoking while pregnant not rewarded for not smoking, how selfish can people be.
Like you said there is nothing worse than seeing a pegnant woman with a fag hanging out their mouth. The baby should take top priority and every precation should be taken to ensure their healthy arrival into this world.
I agree, in fact they should be penilised for smoking while pregnant not rewarded for not smoking, how selfish can people be.
I completely agree - the fact that parents smoke and endanger the health and futures of their children should be officially recorded so that the said child can prosecute later in life should they wish to do so. If the mother / father doesn't give a monkey's about the health of their child they should get what's coming to them later on.. from the individual most affected.
And what proof would there be that the woman wasn't claiming to have stopped smoking to claim her £50 and still having a fly one on the side? Are they going to install cameras in every room in her house and have spies follow her around? what nonsense!
Did you see the paper yestarday that there is a really high figure of babies born in the UK stoned because of the mothers drug taking. This is so sad. But what can you do as said before if people won't give up their habits for the health and well being of their kids then they never will.
[evil]
And what proof would there be that the woman wasn't claiming to have stopped smoking to claim her £50 and still having a fly one on the side? Are they going to install cameras in every room in her house and have spies follow her around? what nonsense!
Apparently they test them during the period of the pregnancy.
http://www.northtonight.tv/content/default.asp?page=s1_1_1&newsid=9344
And what proof would there be that the woman wasn't claiming to have stopped smoking to claim her £50 and still having a fly one on the side? Are they going to install cameras in every room in her house and have spies follow her around? what nonsense!
They don't get £50 any more than when you get a load of vouchers worth £50 from a supermarket you get £50, the vouchers are always for things you never buy.
I agree, in fact they should be penilised for smoking while pregnant not rewarded for not smoking, how selfish can people be.
Like you said there is nothing worse than seeing a pegnant woman with a fag hanging out their mouth. The baby should take top priority and every precation should be taken to ensure their healthy arrival into this world.
Totally agree....
Bingobabe
29-Jun-06, 17:25
I completely agree - the fact that parents smoke and endanger the health and futures of their children should be officially recorded so that the said child can prosecute later in life should they wish to do so. If the mother / father doesn't give a monkey's about the health of their child they should get what's coming to them later on.. from the individual most affected.
I am totally outraged with some of the comments on this thread. Smoking is an addiction just like drink or drug abuse it isnt that easy to stop either!!!
I have a healthy 9 month old baby and i struggled to quit while a was pregnant and just because somebody smokes doesnt mean they dont care about there child. Infact im probabarly a better parent than most!!!I love my child more than life itself and how dare any one be judgemental and say because some one smokes they should get whats coming to them later on in life!!!!What a disgraceful thing to say.:mad:
I am totally outraged with some of the comments on this thread. Smoking is an addiction just like drink or drug abuse it isnt that easy to stop either!!!
I have a healthy 9 month old baby and i struggled to quit while a was pregnant and just because somebody smokes doesnt mean they dont care about there child. Infact im probabarly a better parent than most!!!I love my child more than life itself and how dare any one be judgemental and say because some one smokes they should get whats coming to them later on in life!!!!What a disgraceful thing to say.:mad: i totaly agree with you bingobabe. its not as easy as some may think to quit but on the other hand i do feel that if the mother cears for her child she would try that little bit more to quit. congrats to u bingobabe for making that effort though meany do find it very very difficult.
I am totally outraged with some of the comments on this thread. Smoking is an addiction just like drink or drug abuse it isnt that easy to stop either!!!
I have a healthy 9 month old baby and i struggled to quit while a was pregnant and just because somebody smokes doesnt mean they dont care about there child. Infact im probabarly a better parent than most!!!I love my child more than life itself and how dare any one be judgemental and say because some one smokes they should get whats coming to them later on in life!!!!What a disgraceful thing to say.:mad:
I apologise if you feel dismayed/upset by previous comments made. I understand that giving up must be a nightmare but I still feel the rights of the child are paramount. You don't say if you managed to give up smoking but I hope you have. My husband is a smoker but never smoked near me when I was pregnant and never smokes in the house. I wish he didn't smoke but I can't have everything.
I apologise if you feel dismayed/upset by previous comments made. I understand that giving up must be a nightmare but I still feel the rights of the child are paramount. You don't say if you managed to give up smoking but I hope you have. My husband is a smoker but never smoked near me when I was pregnant and never smokes in the house. I wish he didn't smoke but I can't have everything. its good that your husband was conciderate of you.congrats to him:D
Bingobabe
29-Jun-06, 17:56
i totaly agree with you bingobabe. its not as easy as some may think to quit but on the other hand i do feel that if the mother cears for her child she would try that little bit more to quit. congrats to u bingobabe for making that effort though meany do find it very very difficult.MMMMM Im still trying to give up!!!! And i do care very much for my child so please reframe from passing judgement on others that smoke like i said before it is an addiction.
im not passing judgement sorry if it seems that way just giving my opininon. sorry if offends anyone:roll:
Bingobabe
29-Jun-06, 18:10
I apologise if you feel dismayed/upset by previous comments made. I understand that giving up must be a nightmare but I still feel the rights of the child are paramount. You don't say if you managed to give up smoking but I hope you have. My husband is a smoker but never smoked near me when I was pregnant and never smokes in the house. I wish he didn't smoke but I can't have everything.I do not smoke near my child!!!!!!!!! Just because the law banned people from smoking in public places everybody jumps on the bandwagon and think its there right to pass judgement on smokers. Years ago women smoked heavily while pregnant also they smoked in the same room you didnt hear about cancer then as much as you do today ohhh and before any one trys to say i think its alright to smoke with children in the same room i am not. I am clearly disapointed that people are sterotyping all mothers that smoke and stating they couldnt give a monkeys cause you cant put people in boxes its politically incorrect. And whatever happened to a persons rights its there choice whether they smoke or not or have we suddenely lost our rights on that as well. Ok rant over for now!!!
Bit confused as to why Smoking in say a Pub is a criminal offence as it is classed as endangering peoples health through passive smoking .. BUT .. a pregnant woman is given incentives and basically bribes not to endanger the health of her unborn child.
Are there grounds to treat both situations in the same way ??
I do not smoke near my child!!!!!!!!! Just because the law banned people from smoking in public places everybody jumps on the bandwagon and think its there right to pass judgement on smokers. Years ago women smoked heavily while pregnant also they smoked in the same room you didnt hear about cancer then as much as you do today ohhh and before any one trys to say i think its alright to smoke with children in the same room i am not. I am clearly disapointed that people are sterotyping all mothers that smoke and stating they couldnt give a monkeys cause you cant put people in boxes its politically incorrect. And whatever happened to a persons rights its there choice whether they smoke or not or have we suddenely lost our rights on that as well. Ok rant over for now!!!
you say about a person's rights, what about the unborn child's rights?
orkneylass
29-Jun-06, 19:32
What a fascinating thread. there are a lot of services and quit aids available for people that want to stop smoking, but the point is that they have to want to stop and be prepared to work at it. Yes, nicotine is one of the most highly addictive drugs known to man. Most parents who smoke would not want their children to take it up, yet statistically, the children of smokers are more likely to start.
The argument about choice is an interesting one - would you choose to spend lots of money risking your health, putting up with social disapproval etc etc....or are you addicted to the extent that nicotine is making the choice for you?
There is an awful lot more to being a good parent than whether or not you smoke, but love of your children should be a great incentive to try really hard to quit. And as for the grandchildren....well you would like to be around to see them wouldn't you? 0800 84 84 84 - Smokeline is waiting for your call.
Bingobabe
29-Jun-06, 23:01
For one i did not say that it was morally right to smoke while pregnant!!!For two my baby weighed a healthy 7 pound 14 ounces the biggest baby on the ward and i was the only smoker!!!All i am trying to say is that no one has the right to make statements such as someone does not love or care for their child as much as a non smoker because they dont smoke that is the biggest heap of nonsense i have ever heard. Yes i belive in our human rights choice,freedom of speech ect ect. And it was my choice to smoke not because i dont care or love my child but because smoking is a highly addictive bad habit and which i am trying to kick. And my child will grow up knowing he,s loved and thats the main thing in my eyes. I dont understand how people can get such stupid ideas in there head if thats the way alot of people think no wonder the word discrimanation exsists!!
well really its only shear luck that pregnant women who smoke have healthy babies. i had asthma as a child caused by my mum smoking in her pregnancy. my hubby still has asthma as a result and has to take inhalers every day.
I hate seeing a pregnant women smoking whilst pregant its awful and unhealthy not only for her but her unborn child, i didnt smoke or drink whilst pregnant ( dont smoke anyway) i always thought of my child i was carrying, if my child does get asthma then i wont feel so guilty,if i did smoke i would be punishing myself and this getting vouchers to quit smoking while pregnant is ridiculous, what about the people who have the will power and gave up when the ban came in no one gave them any vouchers or praise so why praise a selfish mother for harming her own flesh and blood.
And what proof would there be that the woman wasn't claiming to have stopped smoking to claim her £50 and still having a fly one on the side? Are they going to install cameras in every room in her house and have spies follow her around? what nonsense!
Simple blood testing: CO2 and nicotine and probably others.....
Hmm, I find the "holier than thou" attitude displayed in some of the previous posts to be a tad distasteful. Bingobabe said she's trying to give up smoking. Why not give her some support instead of being so critical?
As for the vouchers... Again, why not support mothers-to-be who're trying to give up? The "rewards of up to £50 per month" are in the form of vouchers and I'm sure they won't be costing the NHS £50 per head. The companies involved will surely not be charging £50 for each £50-worth of vouchers.
Good luck with quitting Bingobabe!
Hmm, I find the "holier than thou" attitude displayed in some of the previous posts to be a tad distasteful.
a tad??? its very distasteful. Sanctimonious unpleasant looking down their noses if you ask me. I never smoked when i was pregnant - but then i dont smoke full stop so what would i have to be smug about? i had the occasional glass of wine but was never drunk but then i hardly drink at all anyways so again - what do i have to be smug about? All these people who say how terrible it is for a mother to smoke speak of themseves as unselfish and putting the needs tof their children first like they are some sort of icon to aspire to. There are many non smokers amongst mothers who do far worse to their chidlren than have a sneaky fag.
Oh! and there are lots of mums for whom pregnancy isnt the stressfree and easy time we would hope, some women are coping with poverty and relationship issues and money issues and housing issues and work problems and all sorts of things that will contribute to being pregnant being an extremely difficult and stressful time. Its not always an ideal rosey world where giving up smioking is as easy as 1,2,3
I think anything that helps people to stop is to be welcomed and all this sneering and preening isnt helpful at all
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 11:17
well really its only shear luck that pregnant women who smoke have healthy babies. i had asthma as a child caused by my mum smoking in her pregnancy. my hubby still has asthma as a result and has to take inhalers every day.
Absoulte rubbish my mother did not smoke when she was pregnant and breastfeed and i still got asthma!!! Asthma is genitic not caused by smoking if it runs in your family then theres a high possibility that you will pass this on to your children!!!!
There are many non smokers amongst mothers who do far worse to their chidlren than have a sneaky fag.
Any evidence?
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 11:40
MMMMMM for all you lot who a complete saints!!!! It easy for you to critise as you dont smoke and dont know what its like to crave a cigarette or to try and quit and it is one of the most difficult things to do!!! And i think its a good idea to give mothers to be vouchers it gives them more of an incentive to quit. And i hope that it works out for them unlike you lot i wont be looking down my nose at them.
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 11:42
I hate seeing a pregnant women smoking whilst pregant its awful and unhealthy not only for her but her unborn child, i didnt smoke or drink whilst pregnant ( dont smoke anyway) i always thought of my child i was carrying, if my child does get asthma then i wont feel so guilty,if i did smoke i would be punishing myself and this getting vouchers to quit smoking while pregnant is ridiculous, what about the people who have the will power and gave up when the ban came in no one gave them any vouchers or praise so why praise a selfish mother for harming her own flesh and blood.
Dont look then if you hate it so much turn the other cheek.
you no what in the end its the mothers choice weather to smoke or not its no one elses disition and no one has the right to pass judgmet over them. sounds like bingobabe is getting quite agitated over this whole thing:roll:
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 12:16
you no what in the end its the mothers choice weather to smoke or not its no one elses disition and no one has the right to pass judgmet over them. sounds like bingobabe is getting quite agitated over this whole thing:roll:Nope i am not agititated!!! Just trying to put my point across to a few narrow minded people thats all. Ohh and stop rolling your eyes at me!!!
asthma CAN be caused by mothers smoking when pregnant. no one else in my family has it so it aint genetics
changilass
30-Jun-06, 12:53
Any evidence?
I do fostering, so I see some of evidence of what people do to their kids, and they are not all smokers, thats for sure[disgust]
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 13:04
asthma CAN be caused by mothers smoking when pregnant. no one else in my family has it so it aint geneticsProve it!!! Oh you cant its all guess work!![disgust]
I do fostering, so I see some of evidence of what people do to their kids, and they are not all smokers, thats for sure[disgust]
Exactly my point changilass - all this holier than thou stuff over smoking when people turn their face away from children who are beaten and neglected day after day after day.
children who are beaten and neglected day after day after day.
Is that worse than causing birth defects?
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 13:40
Is that worse than causing birth defects?Wheres the proof in that. My aunty had a child who is severly disabled and she did not smoke drink do drugs!!!
Wheres the proof in that. My aunty had a child who is severly disabled and she did not smoke drink do drugs!!!
Health effects of smoking while pregnant
Tobacco smoke and nicotine, a chemical in tobacco smoke, are listed on the California EPA (CAL/EPA) Proposition 65 list of developmental toxins (Cal/EPA Proposition 65 List). This means that an expert group of scientists found sufficient evidence that the compounds can be harmful to unborn children.
According to the American Lung Association® (American Lung Association Date Extracted 1/21/99), "Smokers take in poisons such as nicotine and carbon monoxide (the same gas that comes out of a car's exhaust pipe). These poisons get into the placenta, which is the tissue that connects the mother and the baby before it is born. These poisons keep the unborn baby from getting the food and oxygen needed to grow. As a result babies of smokers are often smaller. The American Lung Association® (American Lung Association Date Extracted 1/21/99) has stated that underweight babies are "often sick with lots of health problems. Smaller babies are more likely to need special care and stay longer in the hospital. Some may die either at birth or within the first year." According to the March of Dimes, other problems associated with smoking during pregnancy include miscarriages, still births, and premature birth (March of Dimes, February 2003). The American Lung Association® has stated that (American Lung Association September 2000) "Smoking during pregnancy is estimated to account for 20 to 30 percent of low-birth weight babies, up to 14 percent of preterm deliveries, and some 10 percent of all infant deaths."
Some of the effects of smoking while pregnant may not be apparent at birth, but are seen as the child starts to develop. Smoking during pregnancy may be a cause of sudden infant death syndrome (crib death), a condition in which apparently healthy babies die suddenly while sleeping (March of Dimes, February 2003). Additionally, maternal smoking during and after pregnancy has been linked to asthma in children (American Lung Association September 2000). In addition, the children may have learning difficulties and behavioral problems (March of Dimes, February 2003).
Just because a smack or a thump is more graphic doesn't mean it is more harmful.
A whole range of things can contribute to birth defects. The majority of the medical profession cannot say for sure what causes birth defects in around 70% of cases. There are clearly links and risks but the point is that you do the best you can to modify your behaviour where you can. If we listened to everything that is said to us about all the risks we would lock up those mothers to be that smoke, are over 35, take a drink, dont take folic acid. To BLAME a mother for the problems her child has is a terrible thing to do. Parents blame themselves anyway. I think that to equate a mother who is struggling to give up smoking through her pregnancy and cuts down and tries hard to a parent who wilfully neglects a child is complete nonsense.
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 15:32
A whole range of things can contribute to birth defects. The majority of the medical profession cannot say for sure what causes birth defects in around 70% of cases. There are clearly links and risks but the point is that you do the best you can to modify your behaviour where you can. If we listened to everything that is said to us about all the risks we would lock up those mothers to be that smoke, are over 35, take a drink, dont take folic acid. To BLAME a mother for the problems her child has is a terrible thing to do. Parents blame themselves anyway. I think that to equate a mother who is struggling to give up smoking through her pregnancy and cuts down and tries hard to a parent who wilfully neglects a child is complete nonsense.Well said !!!!! :Razz
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 15:35
Just because a smack or a thump is more graphic doesn't mean it is more harmful.So what your trying to say is that smacking or thumping a child for example (across the head )is less dangerous than smoking. mmmmm and not to mention a child may suffer mentally for the rest of there life what kinda life is that!!!! So its alright to hit your child as long as you aint smoking at the same time.
So what your trying to say is that smacking or thumping a child for example (across the head )is less dangerous than smoking. mmmmm and not to mention a child may suffer mentally for the rest of there life what kinda life is that!!!! So its alright to hit your child as long as you aint smoking at the same time.
To hit a child out of frustration that is just a parent who is at the end of their tether. To cold and calculatingly smoke during pregnancy and knowing the risks, well that is not recklessness, that is premeditated recklessness. Would you drive around in your car with your child drunk? To kill through recklessness is manslaughter.
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 17:17
To hit a child out of frustration that is just a parent who is at the end of their tether. To cold and calculatingly smoke during pregnancy and knowing the risks, well that is not recklessness, that is premeditated recklessness. Would you drive around in your car with your child drunk? To kill through recklessness is manslaughter.Well for one i very rarely drink and for two i dont drive and would never do something like that!!!!I smoked during my pregnancy because its an addiction like i said before and i didnt condone this as i tried to give up and cut down to 2 a day i am certainly not cold and not calculating!! How dare you make such a ignorant statement i love my child more than life itself so dont ever judge me as you dont know me!!! So get off your high horse and give it a rest this is getting old now!!!
Anyway i would rather be the parent i am today and sleep with a clear conscience at night. Knowing my child is loved well loked after and i would never lift my hand to my child no matter how frustrated i am. I still cant understand why i am explaining my self to you and the rest of the sanctimonious people who seem to think there perfect and have no flaws. THE END!!!!!!
It really isn't my thing to enter into the debate on these sort of topics, but I think this has gone more than far enough. [mad] Questioning whether women who smoke love their children less than anyone else is just plain unkindly judgmental at best, and coming from a lot of people who, in my experience, are normally very caring people. You may as well go on to accuse others who are overweight of not loving their children...what of people who do not have good dental hygiene?...people who drink to excess?...people who gamble?...and on and on.
Behavior is not a flawless reflection of the amounts of love one has for someone else (anyone had a row with your "other half" lately?), and different people also show love to one another differently. We ALL certainly have bad habits, and EVERYTHING a parent does somehow impacts mentally or physically on our children. We are all imperfect humans, sometimes unable to overcome our imperfections, but certainly doing our best to live life and raise our families as we can, in whatever circumstances we have got.
(And for anyone who is interested, no, I do not smoke. I never have. I find the habit extremely distasteful, but I have enough foiables of my own not to think less of those people who have the habit. Also, anyone is welcome to pick holes in what I have said, if you feel you have to. I am having my say right now and will not debate).
But honestly, I don't think this whole ridiculous debate of "bad parental habit=less love for the children" was ever the intended subject of the original post, anyway.
I am at a loss re the following article on GRAMPIAN news.
Pregnant mums who smoke in Tayside are being offered a range of incentives to kick the habit.
A new scheme will offer them incentives worth up to £50 a month if they
NHS Tayside is denying that the incentives are merely bribes.
quit.
Lead Pharmacist of NHS Tayside Andrew Radley said: "It's been proven that only six to eight per cent of people manage to stop smoking even with help, so to try and stop without any help is an uphill struggle. We hope that these incentives plus the social support and the opportunity for them to get nicotine replacement therapy from their local chemist they will stand a bigger chance of kicking the habit for good.
"We're offering things like vouchers for them to buy fresh fruit and vegetables, free entry into fitness and leisure facilities and classes in relaxation and stress management. These things will improve the lives of the women who take part in it.
NHS Tayside will offer them a range of incentives valued at up to £50 a month things like grocery vouchers, access to leisure centres, creche facilites and stress and relaxation classes.
:eek: There are certainly a number of points in that which ARE questionable in my mind! For example, that NHS funding (our taxes) is being used to pay for this scheme. Then, is a £50 handout in vouchers for fresh fruit and entry to the local gym likely to make a big difference? Is this £50 handout actually bribes? Are these things something pregnant women are likely to take advantage of, or are the vouchers just going to go to waste? Are all pregnant women going to automatically be given these, or only those who express a desire to stop smoking? Is £50 actually going to be enough to make a difference at all...if not, then just How effective is this scheme really going to be, in the end?
Perhaps it is Those issues which it would be more worthy to address....
Why don't we just give £50 or vouchers to folk who are suffering from other addictive behavior? Gamblers, alcos, druggies etc, all these can have effects on the health of a child either directly or indirectly.
It is all liberalist nonsense. People should get a grip of theirselves. People can't give up smoking because they aren't trying hard enough. ;)
Rheghead,
Spot on .. I gave up because I knew it was bad for me .. I go to the Gym as it is good for me .. I eat healthily as I dont want to be overwieght and a prime candidate for a heart attack .. basically I take responsibility for my own welfare. And guess what ?? .. I dont want to be compensated or congratulated because I class it as being .. oh whats thats the word ?? .. oh yeah thats it .. RESPONSIBLE.
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 21:17
Rheghead,
Spot on .. I gave up because I knew it was bad for me .. I go to the Gym as it is good for me .. I eat healthily as I dont want to be overwieght and a prime candidate for a heart attack .. basically I take responsibility for my own welfare. And guess what ?? .. I dont want to be compensated or congratulated because I class it as being .. oh whats thats the word ?? .. oh yeah thats it .. RESPONSIBLE.
Who asked you to fund it no me anyway i pay my taxes and work hard so what i smoke pipe down people!!!And i am paying for the patches myself i have never taken hand outs and i am not gonna start now. Just because i smoke dosent mean i aint RESPONSIBLE really stupid statement to make!!!
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 21:19
Why don't we just give £50 or vouchers to folk who are suffering from other addictive behavior? Gamblers, alcos, druggies etc, all these can have effects on the health of a child either directly or indirectly.
It is all liberalist nonsense. People should get a grip of theirselves. People can't give up smoking because they aren't trying hard enough. ;)
You can tell that you have never had an addiction with all the comments you have made!!!!!
Who asked you to fund it no me anyway i pay my taxes and work hard so what i smoke pipe down people!!!And i am paying for the patches myself i have never taken hand outs and i am not gonna start now. Just because i smoke dosent mean i aint RESPONSIBLE really stupid statement to make!!!
Calm down Dear .. Its only a commercial !!
If these payments go ahead I Wont be asked to fund them .. I WILL be funding them through my taxes .. and I pay more than most. My point was that Pregnant women who smoke are not being responsible regarding their unborn baby, and paying them to stop doing something them they KNOW is possibly damaging the baby is just stupid. In that case being responsible means stop smoking doesnt it ??
These payments are just another symptom of the Nanny state we now live in where the individual has always got something to blame anything on .. Like "Oh its an addiction" .. I gave up and did so with no patches .. I just stopped because I knew it was bad for me .. Simple As .. And believe me i am far from a Superman !! .. I just took responsibility for ME .. what you do is your buisness .. but if you are giving up .. Best of Luck .. ;)
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 22:38
Calm down Dear .. Its only a commercial !!
If these payments go ahead I Wont be asked to fund them .. I WILL be funding them through my taxes .. and I pay more than most. My point was that Pregnant women who smoke are not being responsible regarding their unborn baby, and paying them to stop doing something them they KNOW is possibly damaging the baby is just stupid. In that case being responsible means stop smoking doesnt it ??
These payments are just another symptom of the Nanny state we now live in where the individual has always got something to blame anything on .. Like "Oh its an addiction" .. I gave up and did so with no patches .. I just stopped because I knew it was bad for me .. Simple As .. And believe me i am far from a Superman !! .. I just took responsibility for ME .. what you do is your buisness .. but if you are giving up .. Best of Luck .. ;)Ok i am bored of this thread it is getting rather tedious!!!!!!!WHITE FLAG IS UP!!!!!!! But i still stick to my opions that i have expressed on this thread as i belive i am right!!! Some people should take a look at there own lives before they get on there high horses and judge!!!!!!!!!!!
1 .. I did take a look at my own life and thats why I made the choices I did.
2 .. Im not judging .. "what you do is your buisness" .. Im just giving my opinion .. the same as you.
Bingobabe
30-Jun-06, 23:11
1 .. I did take a look at my own life and thats why I made the choices I did.
2 .. Im not judging .. "what you do is your buisness" .. Im just giving my opinion .. the same as you.Whatever subject closed end of discussion!!!!!
orkneylass
30-Jun-06, 23:12
Do we live in a society where those who do what is scientifically demonstrated to be negative for the wellbeing of themselves and others dare not be criticised and where those who take responsibility for their wellbeing and that of others are seen as sanctimonious and judgmental??? Are we not getting some things a bit skewed here? Is it not possible to be a great parent and love your child, yet still to be human, fallible and prone to excusing one's weaknesses rather than facing up to them???
there has never been more help than now for those who truly want to quit smoking. those who don't want to can argue against the scientific and statistical evidence until they are blue in the face. It's not about one lot of people condemning another but it is about truth, honesty, responsibility.....
1 .. I did take a look at my own life and thats why I made the choices I did.
2 .. Im not judging .. "what you do is your buisness" .. Im just giving my opinion .. the same as you.
Well said.
Bingobabe
01-Jul-06, 02:12
Well said.I belive you have taken this thread a bit to personal according to your deleted post!!!!
Bingobabe
01-Jul-06, 02:14
Do we live in a society where those who do what is scientifically demonstrated to be negative for the wellbeing of themselves and others dare not be criticised and where those who take responsibility for their wellbeing and that of others are seen as sanctimonious and judgmental??? Are we not getting some things a bit skewed here? Is it not possible to be a great parent and love your child, yet still to be human, fallible and prone to excusing one's weaknesses rather than facing up to them???
there has never been more help than now for those who truly want to quit smoking. those who don't want to can argue against the scientific and statistical evidence until they are blue in the face. It's not about one lot of people condemning another but it is about truth, honesty, responsibility.....I am a responsible person and its not up to you or anyone else to condem me because i smoke!!!Anyway i think this thread has gone far enough dont you????? Like i have said before i will no longer justicify myself to people who dont know me. AND THE LAST THING I AM GOING TO SAY IS loving your child and smoking has nothing to do with it!!!I will have my opion you have yours. I will no longer particapate in this thread as i have no more to say on the subject!!
Bingobabe,
No one is condemning you that I can see and of course you can smoke all you want .. free country isnt it. I think what people are trying to point out is that its bad for you. If you notice when you said you had bought patches I wished you luck with stopping but no one has told you to stop have they ?? (and I certainly wouldnt dream of it), The topic was about Pregnant women smoking which is just stupid and being given incentives to stop is just even more stupid (and a waste of our taxes) as a Responsible pregnant women wouldnt smoke at all. No one with a shred of responsibility would risk their children in ANY way would they ??
If anyone is taking this thread personally it is you I am afraid.
Calm Down Dear .. its only a commercial .. ;)
changilass
01-Jul-06, 03:04
I can not say what my opinion is regarding some of the posts on this thread because I would get barred for life.
Making out that smoking whilst pregnant should be treated as manslaughter is laughable at best.
Stating that hitting kids because you have lost the plot is ok, to my mind comes under the heading of abuse.
Some folk should take a look at their own glass houses before they start throwing stones.
Reading your comments on this thread, Rheghead, I am assuming that you have no bad habits, addictions or faults, you are ovbiously Sainthood material, please let me know which committee votes on this, so I can put in a letter of commendation as you are so obviously perfection personified[disgust]
Rheghead, I am assuming that you have no bad habits, addictions or faults, you are ovbiously Sainthood material, please let me know which committee votes on this, so I can put in a letter of commendation as you are so obviously perfection personified[disgust]
Of course! I revel in the fact that I am so perfect. :Razz
Making out that smoking whilst pregnant should be treated as manslaughter is laughable at best
How is it?
Take reckless driving for instance. A chap speeds round a blind bend on the wrong side of a lonely highland road to overtake a car. He knows full well that there may be cars coming but small chance. He is being reckless to life and limb. Similiarly, a woman takes a reckless decision to smoke while pregnant in that she may harm her unborn baby if she knows there are risks attached. It is the same frame of mind.
How is it?
Take reckless driving for instance. A chap speeds round a blind bend on the wrong side of a lonely highland road to overtake a car. He knows full well that there may be cars coming but small chance. He is being reckless to life and limb. Similiarly, a woman takes a reckless decision to smoke while pregnant in that she may harm her unborn baby if she knows there are risks attached. It is the same frame of mind.
Sorry Rheg I think the mothers are winning this discussion hands down, and I am going to side with them, I'm no daft :cool:
rockchick
01-Jul-06, 11:40
How is it?
Take reckless driving for instance. A chap speeds round a blind bend on the wrong side of a lonely highland road to overtake a car. He knows full well that there may be cars coming but small chance. He is being reckless to life and limb. Similiarly, a woman takes a reckless decision to smoke while pregnant in that she may harm her unborn baby if she knows there are risks attached. It is the same frame of mind.
A more accurate analogy might be comparing smoking during pregnant to driving with a tyre who's tread is worn just below the legal limit. It is a hazard that MIGHT lead to an crash that wouldn't otherwise occur, but is no where near the risk level that blind overtaking is.
(By the way, whilst I don't smoke, I do have an addiction, which I battle with every day.)
Bingobabe
01-Jul-06, 13:02
Bingobabe,
No one is condemning you that I can see and of course you can smoke all you want .. free country isnt it. I think what people are trying to point out is that its bad for you. If you notice when you said you had bought patches I wished you luck with stopping but no one has told you to stop have they ?? (and I certainly wouldnt dream of it), The topic was about Pregnant women smoking which is just stupid and being given incentives to stop is just even more stupid (and a waste of our taxes) as a Responsible pregnant women wouldnt smoke at all. No one with a shred of responsibility would risk their children in ANY way would they ??
If anyone is taking this thread personally it is you I am afraid.
Calm Down Dear .. its only a commercial .. ;)I was going to leave this as it was but you are really begining to annoy me!!! But you keep on pushing and pushing the matter further than it needs to be disscussed what right have you got to call anyone stupid?????Making out your a saint i bet you got alot more skeletons in your closet than your making out!!!And another thing our taxes pay for alot of useless things trying to help a pregnant mother is a good thing not a stupid one have a little bit of compassion or dont you possess such a thing!!!
Bingobabe,
No one is condemning you that I can see and of course you can smoke all you want .. free country isnt it. I think what people are trying to point out is that its bad for you. If you notice when you said you had bought patches I wished you luck with stopping but no one has told you to stop have they ?? (and I certainly wouldnt dream of it), The topic was about Pregnant women smoking which is just stupid and being given incentives to stop is just even more stupid (and a waste of our taxes) as a Responsible pregnant women wouldnt smoke at all. No one with a shred of responsibility would risk their children in ANY way would they ??
If anyone is taking this thread personally it is you I am afraid.
Calm Down Dear .. its only a commercial .. EXCUSE ME! i take that to offence and im not even pregnant!!!!!!!! i never have been. but it still gets right up my nose when people try to act all inoccent when they proberly have more dark secrets than the rest of us! i realy wish people would think befor they speek and im sure im not the only one who feels this way[disgust] [evil] some people always have to take it tooooooo far
Bingobabe
01-Jul-06, 18:13
EXCUSE ME! i take that to offence and im not even pregnant!!!!!!!! i never have been. but it still gets right up my nose when people try to act all inoccent when they proberly have more dark secrets than the rest of us! i realy wish people would think befor they speek and im sure im not the only one who feels this way[disgust] [evil] some people always have to take it tooooooo farWELL SAID!!!!
pultneytooner
01-Jul-06, 18:21
I completely agree - the fact that parents smoke and endanger the health and futures of their children should be officially recorded so that the said child can prosecute later in life should they wish to do so. If the mother / father doesn't give a monkey's about the health of their child they should get what's coming to them later on.. from the individual most affected. Yeah we will all go down the american path, if it looks at you the wrong way, sue it.
Make smoking, drinking, etc, whilst pregnant, illegal.
If people can't realise the harm they cause their babies whilst smoking let's take the resposibility away from them.
I was going to leave this as it was but you are really begining to annoy me!!! But you keep on pushing and pushing the matter further than it needs to be disscussed what right have you got to call anyone stupid?????Making out your a saint i bet you got alot more skeletons in your closet than your making out!!!And another thing our taxes pay for alot of useless things trying to help a pregnant mother is a good thing not a stupid one have a little bit of compassion or dont you possess such a thing!!!
Sorry if I annoyed you by answering your posts .. what was I thinking ??
Why didnt you stick to your post of "Whatever end of discussion etc" if you dont like people replying to you ?? .. When you post on a public forum then people will sometimes disagree with what you post .. last time I checked it was a messageboard for discussion .. and by the way I just checked my posts and not once did I call you stupid .. not once. So I suggest that you actually READ what I write before you reply.
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