View Full Version : Drug addicts to be offered cash
To be sterilised. An American Charity offering £200 to Drug addicts agreeing to sterilisation. On BBC news this morning, can't find a link.
We've talked a lot about 'rights' recently and I wondered what you orgers think about this?
Maybe you have a list of other groups you think would benefit from such a programme ;)
Males/Females who have more than 3 kids before they are 22
DeHaviLand
27-Apr-10, 13:12
Anybody that doesnt make a useful contribution to society. But please, dont get me started, I've not had any Highland Park yet!:roll:
John Little
27-Apr-10, 13:20
People receiving over £40,000 in benefits with house and car provided by the local authority, don't work and have no intention of doing so and have 7 kids and want more....
Oh and anyone who's not in my tribe.
I'm starting to think Idiocracy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy) was prophetic. Also that the Harvey Danger lyric ' ... Been around the world and found, that only stupid people are breeding, the cretins cloning and feeding ... ' is becoming more apt every day.
fingalmacool
27-Apr-10, 13:52
To be sterilised. An American Charity offering £200 to Drug addicts agreeing to sterilisation. On BBC news this morning, can't find a link.
We've talked a lot about 'rights' recently and I wondered what you orgers think about this?
Maybe you have a list of other groups you think would benefit from such a programme ;)
How long do you think this post will last if anyone got ripped into this debate, not long i feel???:confused
Shabbychic
27-Apr-10, 14:32
I'm starting to think Idiocracy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy) was prophetic. Also that the Harvey Danger lyric ' ... Been around the world and found, that only stupid people are breeding, the cretins cloning and feeding ... ' is becoming more apt every day.
Oh dear. I notice you don't have any smileys, so I take it this is your real thoughts.
Isn't this all harking back to the Euganics debates of the past. This is a very dangerous road to even contemplate. It was legalised in some countries in the past, not just Germany, and in fact in Oregon, it was continued right up to 1978.
Now a US charity, who claim to have sterilised over 3.500 in the US, are offering the same service here in the UK. In this day and age this is disgraceful, and a very slippery slope to be on.:(
ShelleyCowie
27-Apr-10, 15:04
To be sterilised. An American Charity offering £200 to Drug addicts agreeing to sterilisation. On BBC news this morning, can't find a link.
We've talked a lot about 'rights' recently and I wondered what you orgers think about this?
Maybe you have a list of other groups you think would benefit from such a programme ;)
I watch alot of medical programs and on them are stories of mothers who are serious drug abusers here and in the US. They have children, then leave the hospital without telling anyone and leave their children behind :( Yes its best for the baby, but still very very sad this happens.
I could be shot down for the fact that i am not working, obviously i cant right now but it annoys me that i cant work. But thats life, i stay at home and look after my son and will do the same with my next child (the last i swear!!!) lol. but my OH works and earns enough for us all :) not forgetting he works through an affecting medical condition.
Anyways............can it really be done that they will offer drug users money to get sterilised? I sadly think that alot of the might accept it for the money more than anything
Why dont they save the cash from sterelising them and buy a ship load of heroin or whatever poison it and flood the market.
All the junkies are dead game over. If there is nobody to buy the product there is no need for supply...
Makes sense ;)
Oh dear. I notice you don't have any smileys, so I take it this is your real thoughts.
Isn't this all harking back to the Euganics debates of the past. This is a very dangerous road to even contemplate. It was legalised in some countries in the past, not just Germany, and in fact in Oregon, it was continued right up to 1978.
Now a US charity, who claim to have sterilised over 3.500 in the US, are offering the same service here in the UK. In this day and age this is disgraceful, and a very slippery slope to be on.:(
I'm not preaching enforced mandated eugenics, I'm a fairly liberal person actually. Just considering the idea of offering incentives to some people. I'm worried (ever so slightly, in a reductio ad absurdum way) we're moving towards an anti-intellectual dysgenic society, which would be Vonnegut-Harrison-Bergeron like at best.
John Little
27-Apr-10, 16:08
It was the Liberals who introduced state help for people who needed it. But even as they introduced it they were afraid of the consequences of having a system which gave hand-outs to those who did not need it.
There's a vast difference between giving it to good folk such as speak on this forum on the topic and scroungers who run Mercs, have better tellys than I do, a free house, 7 kids and still plan to have more.
The system needs reform, and nobody is getting at anyone here.
i think we are almost there.. i think back to the time just a few hundred years ago where the people were deliberately kept illeterate so as to control the masses. only the nobility and church were allowed to read and write and even then it was only the men in most cases.
our society is not in a golden age by any means.. no matter what the all knowing box we worship tell us.
at the moment we are a society build on the back of poverty and suffering, and the underworld is rising up to swallow everything.
kinda reminds me of another great nation right before it fell.
should people be sterlised? i think theres a whole lot of them that should. if they volunteer for it.. id say go for it.
i always said that if you waited to you could afford to have a baby you would never have one, however i also believe that you should be able to nurture a child and at least feed clothe and give them the necessites of life if not the luxuries.
Why dont they save the cash from sterelising them and buy a ship load of heroin or whatever poison it and flood the market.
All the junkies are dead game over. If there is nobody to buy the product there is no need for supply...
Makes sense ;)
Mmmm......theres a thought.
Our grandfathers fought and died to stop Hitler doing the very same thing. It starts with drug addicts and alcoholics but where does it end? Who has the right to decide that someone else has no right to procreate?
John Little
27-Apr-10, 18:38
I do not question the right to procreate. I do question the right of some to do it again and again and expect society to pick up the tab.
I do not question the right to procreate. I do question the right of some to do it again and again and expect society to pick up the tab.
Plenty who do that who aren't on drink/drugs... Do we sterilise them too?
The Drunken Duck
27-Apr-10, 18:51
I do not question the right to procreate. I do question the right of some to do it again and again and expect society to pick up the tab.
Yeah but Drug Addicts are a leech on all of us without even procreating John. After all the poor little darlings now have their self inflicted habit classed as a "Disability" and are "entitled" to free Methadone. Some numpties even want to give them Heroin on the NHS and have, in effect, state sponsored drug addiction.
They dont need sterilised, they need a good foot in the knackers after a long run up. Which might just do the job come to think of it.
Our grandfathers fought and died to stop Hitler doing the very same thing. It starts with drug addicts and alcoholics but where does it end? Who has the right to decide that someone else has no right to procreate?
Me, if I'm paying for it.
John Little
27-Apr-10, 21:10
"Plenty who do that who aren't on drink/drugs... Do we sterilise them too?"
Nope - but we stop being the mugs who pay them.
"Plenty who do that who aren't on drink/drugs... Do we sterilise them too?"
Nope - but we stop being the mugs who pay them.
Fair enough but forced/coerced sterilisation is not the way to go :(
maybe if we castrated convicted drug dealers life would be so much simpler. [disgust]
I would gladly sterilise them all myself and agree wholeheartedly with nearly all of the posts on here. I could also add a few more categories to the list of folk that I would happily stop procreating. As others have already said, if we are picking up the tab to keep them and their burgeoning families WE DO have the right to say enough is enough.[disgust]
I could also add a few more categories to the list of folk that I would happily stop procreating. As others have already said, if we are picking up the tab to keep them and their burgeoning families WE DO have the right to say enough is enough.[disgust]
Actually WW2 is proof that you don't :roll:
maybe if we castrated convicted drug dealers life would be so much simpler. [disgust]
Maybe if we dealt with other anti-social habits we would be on to a winner. :)
Maybe if we dealt with other anti-social habits we would be on to a winner. :)
Such as Moira? In my opinion drug dealers are the lowest of the low, they take advantage of the weakest in society, nothing more anti-social [disgust]
Such as Moira? In my opinion drug dealers are the lowest of the low, they take advantage of the weakest in society, nothing more anti-social [disgust]
Such as the Publican who serves one more drink to one who is over the score in order to up his profit on the bar. It happens....
Such as the Publican who serves one more drink to one who is over the score in order to up his profit on the bar. It happens....
sorry Moira no comparison, a publican has legal business, drug dealers, victimise the weak for profit.
I guess it's all relevant
Apart from the legality of it all is there a difference?
Tubthumper
28-Apr-10, 00:05
Actually WW2 is proof that you don't :roll:
I don't get this. Could you explain please?
I guess it's all relevant
Apart from the legality of it all is there a difference?
Well yes Moira, most of us normal humans think that Drug dealers and those that profit from the distribution of illeagal drugs for profit, are not the main stream of humanity. Do you not agree?
Tubthumper
28-Apr-10, 00:31
I was distressed to see Panorama the other night about the idle chaps who get about £12k a year for doing nowt. This worries me.
What also worries me is that someone is signing the paperwork for these bums to continue receiving cash and doing sod all in return.
All the junkies and 'disturbed' people I know seem to have access to endless cash, while a worrying number of youngsters seem to be able to get special support for their troubles, then migrate effortlessly into a worthless, expensive & needy adulthood.
We're facing unprecedented cuts in public spending. Me and many others like me might not have jobs this time next year. And I bet we won't get much support (unless we become junkies!).
So if all us 'real' people end up on the dole, there's no-one earning or paying taxes, and all the bankers keep stashing their money offshore, who is going to subsidise the dross of our society?
Pay junkies to get sterilised? I think it's time we established a 'support provided according to contribution' culture.
Well yes Moira, most of us normal humans think that Drug dealers and those that profit from the distribution of illeagal drugs for profit, are not the main stream of humanity. Do you not agree?
That's a very fine philosophy Golach. I'm pretty normal so please keep forcing your foot into your mouth. :)
That's a very fine philosophy Golach. I'm pretty normal so please keep forcing your foot into your mouth. :)
LMAO Moira
Shabbychic
28-Apr-10, 00:47
maybe if we castrated convicted drug dealers life would be so much simpler. [disgust]
How would castrating convicted drug dealers make life simpler? Does this mean that all drug dealers are the offspring of convicted drug dealers? :eek:
How would castrating convicted drug dealers make life simpler? Does this mean that all drug dealers are the offspring of convicted drug dealers? :eek:
well if we castrated drug dealers, their offspring may think of another occupation
Shabbychic
28-Apr-10, 00:55
well if we castrated drug dealers, their offspring may thing of another occupation
Surely if we castrated the drug dealers, there wouldn't be any offspring.
Surely if we castrated the drug dealers, there wouldn't be any offspring.
Exactly!!!!!!!!!!
Shabbychic
28-Apr-10, 01:00
Exactly!!!!!!!!!!
So, I ask again, does that mean all drug dealers are the offspring of convicted drug dealers? :confused
So, I ask again, does that mean all drug dealers are the offspring of convicted drug dealers? :confused
to my knowledge it usually runs in the Family, if your father is a dealer then you are generally a dealer as well
This thread is hilarious - keep it coming folks...
Chobbersjnr
28-Apr-10, 03:03
I glanced my way through this thread & heck I have to lol very loudly. Absolutely hilarious[lol][lol]
amazing in fact.
Aaldtimer
28-Apr-10, 03:27
well if we castrated drug dealers, their offspring may thing of another occupation
There wouldn't be any offspring in your scenario!
Does the phrase "The sins of the fathers" ring any bells with you?:confused
Confuse him not with facts, confound him not with logic, the once Original Grumpy Owld Man has made up his mind. Leave him to his obsessions and specious spurious arguments.:Razz I have noticed that the tone of his posts changes after a certain time of night probably after he has consumed enough of his favourite legal drug.
Metalattakk
28-Apr-10, 03:53
Surprised there's no emphasis on 'legal' there, G2.
How remiss of you. ;)
Kevin Milkins
28-Apr-10, 04:21
The thread so far seems to have concentrated on castration and kicks to the male genitalia in order to lessen the chance of breeding, and yet it was my understanding of the bit I saw on the news that it was aimed at better contraception, or more drastically sterilisation of females.
I thought that men who take hard drugs, (no pun intended), lost there libido anyway, but women that were desperate for cash for the next fix would prostitute themselves and end up with an unwanted pregnancy and an at risk child.
I would be concerned if we had the power to insist on taking away a persons right to breed, however it would seem that if it was managed and administered in a open and responsible manner then the overall benefits to the drug addict, society, and an at risk child would outweigh many of the negatives.
I would be concerned if we had the power to insist on taking away a persons right to breed, however it would seem that if it was managed and administered in a open and responsible manner then the overall benefits to the drug addict, society, and an at risk child would outweigh many of the negatives.
Yeah Hitler said something like that too...
I don't believe there is any evidence that drug addiction is hereditary, I don't believe there is a drug addict gene.
What does seem to be hereditary is hatred, man's need to hate his fellow man, throughout history it has done far more harm than any drug. What seems to be truly addictive however, what people can't seem to live without is a need to feel superior. So many people just can't survive without their daily fix of looking down their noses at other people.
I have a feeling if we could isolate these genes, breed the hatred and the delusion of grandeur out of man the drug problem would go away on it's own.
The Drunken Duck
28-Apr-10, 07:57
This thread is hilarious - keep it coming folks...
Not half as funny as you sitting on the sidelines with a superior attitude comparing every comment you dont like to Hitler or World War 2.
Do you have any original thoughts yourself on the subject or are you just trying to convince yourself your big and clever ??
(If so keep going .. you have a way to go yet)
Ignoring the mass Reductio ad Hitlerum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_Hitlerum) invocation of Godwin's law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law). Basically reducing and relating everything to Hitler in the hopes of undermining. Both Hitler and Stalin had moustaches, not everyone with a moustaches is like them; correlation does not imply causation. You can not ignore an idea simple because someone bad also did it. Many dictators have also implemented beneficial policies.
That being said I see nothing wrong with encouraging something via economic or societal imperatives, its already done with many things.
Also people don't have a right to procreate and for others to endure the expense and inconvenience.
On a side note I don't think drug dealers are the problem either, but many do. The problem is addicts, dealers would go out of business if they had no customers.
I have a feeling if we could isolate these genes, breed the hatred and the delusion of grandeur out of man the drug problem would go away on it's own.
How so? All the drug addicts I knew (and I used to know a lot, not now though) made the decision to take up drugs. I don't think it was because they hated anyone or that they felt hated. It seems to me, from the reaction to this thread, that people hate drug addicts. Not the people they were before they became drug addicts. Nore presumably the people they willl become if they decide to stop.
Rarely, I would postulate, are current drug addicts a benefit to society. When you get 18 year olds with £1000 a week habits, you get a one person crime wave causing suffering and misery to anyone around them.
How so? All the drug addicts I knew (and I used to know a lot, not now though) made the decision to take up drugs. I don't think it was because they hated anyone or that they felt hated. It seems to me, from the reaction to this thread, that people hate drug addicts. Not the people they were before they became drug addicts. Nore presumably the people they willl become if they decide to stop.
I think if someone being interviewed by the careers advisory person at school decided to pick drug addict as their chosen future the range of options offered to them must have been limited.
I think if someone being interviewed by the careers advisory person at school decided to pick drug addict as their chosen future the range of options offered to them must have been limited.
If you are going to take the pee, I will sulk :Razz
The Drunken Duck
28-Apr-10, 08:38
How so? All the drug addicts I knew (and I used to know a lot, not now though) made the decision to take up drugs. I don't think it was because they hated anyone or that they felt hated. It seems to me, from the reaction to this thread, that people hate drug addicts. Not the people they were before they became drug addicts. Nore presumably the people they willl become if they decide to stop.
Rarely, I would postulate, are current drug addicts a benefit to society. When you get 18 year olds with £1000 a week habits, you get a one person crime wave causing suffering and misery to anyone around them.
Yup .. very true.
I had a Junkie try and break into my flat when I was Offshore once. Went to court and he spun his sob story and out he walked with not even a fine. Apparently the poor guy was "trying to put his life together", apparently by nicking other peoples gear. Then he had the audacity to stop me in the street and remind he knew the next time I was going to be Offshore. So I dragged him up the nearest alley and kicked the crap out of him. My flat wasnt touched after that.
This was about three years ago, saw the lad just before Xmas and he has kicked the habit, got himself a job and a girlfriend and is a productive member of society these days. He even came over and bought me a pint one night to say sorry. I did the same and there are no hard feeling between us, in fact I recently bought him a few to celebrate the birth of his son. He bears me no ill will either as he says that if someone did to him now what he did to me then he would do exactly the same.
Surprised there's no emphasis on 'legal' there, G2.
How remiss of you. ;)
I wouldn't dare suggest that the poster in question would take anything illegal.:)
This thread is hilarious - keep it coming folks...
What exactly do you find hilarious about this thread? You are obviously sitting on your high horse and from that elevated position, feel that you can tower above the bigoted masses by comparing them to Hitler whilst basking in your perceived moral superiority. Why not try a few high jumps next?
John Little
28-Apr-10, 22:07
I think she does not mind paying for them....
I think she does not mind paying for them....
You could well be right.:roll:
Boozeburglar
29-Apr-10, 16:55
The ignorance displayed in this thread is evidence that the last thing we need in this society is more democracy.
I take illegal drugs. Always have, most likely with the intolerant and ignorant approach of the government I always will.
So do many people I have encountered who have progressive illnesses, and to good effect.
That fact alone lends me the view that the argument is not cut and dried.
If anyone serves someone who is obviously drunk in any licensed establishment they are doing so illegally.
The ignorance displayed in this thread is evidence that the last thing we need in this society is more democracy.
If anyone serves someone who is obviously drunk in any licensed establishment they are doing so illegally.
Dead right on both points.
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.