View Full Version : demonisation of children
onecalledk
07-Mar-10, 20:26
Is it just me or does this board at the moment seem to think that the root of all societies evils is the child?
We were ALL children once and I think that back in our childhood we were all told off for being badly behaved etc. Perhaps for some people on this board that is a long way in the past but NO period in history has perfectly mannered kids....
Wonder why society is in the state it is in ? well if we all blame the parents its easy isnt it? what about the parents constant war with the media, society, internet etc that is raging?
Children it appears are damned if they do and damned if they dont..... they are children, they have to learn, they should be told off if they do wrong full stop, and by that I mean by ANYONE.
On holiday recently in the Isle of Man my child, myself and my partner were in cafe, child was whingeing and moaning about what he wanted to eat, he got told off by us. Then he got told off by the little old lady that was standing in front of us. The look on his little face was priceless. The lady was very polite about it , telling him not to talk to his mum like that it was cheeky, polite but firm. (he was 7). Far from launching into her telling her to mind her own, I was grateful for someone else backing me up in what I was saying. It shut him up for a good while and I explained to him that he was by whingeing upsetting other people around him.
If children got told off like this all the time but other people as well as just parents then it might work a bit better. Better that the looks and tutting that is usually dished out .......
K
I absolutely agree, I always said if my child was playing up or misbehaving I would want to know about it and would be happier to be told at the time by someone than find out when it got out of hand and was too late to stop.
Whitewater
07-Mar-10, 22:15
Is it just me or does this board at the moment seem to think that the root of all societies evils is the child?
We were ALL children once and I think that back in our childhood we were all told off for being badly behaved etc. Perhaps for some people on this board that is a long way in the past but NO period in history has perfectly mannered kids....
Wonder why society is in the state it is in ? well if we all blame the parents its easy isnt it? what about the parents constant war with the media, society, internet etc that is raging?
Children it appears are damned if they do and damned if they dont..... they are children, they have to learn, they should be told off if they do wrong full stop, and by that I mean by ANYONE.
On holiday recently in the Isle of Man my child, myself and my partner were in cafe, child was whingeing and moaning about what he wanted to eat, he got told off by us. Then he got told off by the little old lady that was standing in front of us. The look on his little face was priceless. The lady was very polite about it , telling him not to talk to his mum like that it was cheeky, polite but firm. (he was 7). Far from launching into her telling her to mind her own, I was grateful for someone else backing me up in what I was saying. It shut him up for a good while and I explained to him that he was by whingeing upsetting other people around him.
If children got told off like this all the time but other people as well as just parents then it might work a bit better. Better that the looks and tutting that is usually dished out .......
K
Have to agree with you, but all too often people like the old lady are told by the childs parents to buzz off (often not as polite as that) and mind their own business.
I grew up in the society you describe and I had problems with self confidence quite bad ones too.
It helps if you have a good strong family around you which unfortunatly i didnt.
It was only till i went to college and learned a trade that my issues were on the track to becoming resolved though i still struggle. Just look out for the stragglers!
scottygirl
15-Mar-10, 01:23
If folk are visiting our house with their children and the kids are cheeky, naughty whatever, I will tell them off even if their own parents don't. My house, my rules. They don't get treats unless they ask politely and thank me. A little courtesy goes a very long way in my book.
Most guests take this well, the ones that don't tend to be the ones who don't think their kids ever do anything wrong.
Also a good deterent for the parents, "don't behave and you will get in trouble from ""her"".
Outside of the house, well, I have to admit to being a lot more restrained. I have come across the ranting parents brigade far too many times and it's just not worth the hassel. I do agree that if we did speak up more it might improve the situation but the hassel factor is not one I particularly enjoy.
Some folk raise their kids, others choose to drag them up.
I do think that the lions share of children are not taught manners to the same extent that perhaps the slightly older generation (mine) were (I'm thinking the 30s and overs here).
Rarely do I see youngsters opening doors for others, or offering their seats on buses/trains. Or even just saying please/thank you/excuse me.
I was brought up to respect my elders, to not swear in front of them, to behave whilst out in public and especially in someone elses house. To ask and not just take. Please and thank you were par for the course and I still get laughed at at work for always, and I mean always saying bless you when someone sneezes. I say pardon when I miss what folk say something and want them to repeat it, another thing folk laugh at me for. I think all of these things are givens in my book. I teach my nieces and nephews these things when they are with me. Not something their own parents are that fussed about pushing on them but are happy enough for me to try.
Sad really but that is how this generation seem to be and that will only get worse.
Pity.....
Then he got told off by the little old lady that was standing in front of us. The look on his little face was priceless. The lady was very polite about it , telling him not to talk to his mum like that it was cheeky, polite but firm. (he was 7). Far from launching into her telling her to mind her own, I was grateful for someone else backing me up in what I was saying.
I recently got bashed in the ankles by a child running around the supermarket with a shopping trolley (a particular pet hate of mine). I turned round and exlaimed "Ouch, watch where you are going!" and got told in no uncertain terms that she was appalled that I was disciplining her child. My reply was "Are you not embarrassed that someone has to?". She walked quietly away...
Kids, I believe are inherantly good. A child that is brought up in a household or balanced praise/discipline will strive to be told that they are good and that their parents are proud of them. Children, of course, will test their parents and with boundaries they learn where the limits are. Children need to know where the boundaries are to feel secure. Remove them and they keep pushing until something snaps. Remove praise and it escalates as they need attention.
They need to know someone will take control and make them feel safe. A child will take control if they have to (ie boundaries not set) but they will never be a happy child :(
All this of course is stating the obvious I guess...
Children need boundaries and need to know if they go past the boundaries there are consequences.One of mine over stepped the boundary at the weekend and he is now grounded for a month with loss of all liberties and his pocket money is donated to charity.I said it before and I will say it again,a lot of the problem is parents who cannot see their child could do anything wrong-those children do not learn anything by this and thats when the rot starts to set it,I would rather punish my child than have them run amock x
Children need boundaries and need to know if they go past the boundaries there are consequences.One of mine over stepped the boundary at the weekend and he is now grounded for a month with loss of all liberties and his pocket money is donated to charity.I said it before and I will say it again,a lot of the problem is parents who cannot see their child could do anything wrong-those children do not learn anything by this and thats when the rot starts to set it,I would rather punish my child than have them run amock x
Yep and threats don't work! My young cousins were coming riding with me for the first time and they 'don't do' seatbelts. They usually pretty much do as I ask but on this day they were adamant they weren't wearing a seatbelt. I warned them that if they didn't put them on they weren't coming and they ummed and ahhed. I told them to get out of the car and riding was cancelled. They then started crying and put their belts on but I still held my ground and said they weren't going as they had their warning and still refused. My aunty said "but they're wearing them now". But that wasn't the point. She still doesn't 'get it' - and still has problems with them... I knew that if I had given in at that point we would have had the debate every time - yes they would have given in eventually but it would have been a huge fuss every time. The next week I went to pick them up and they got in the car and belted up no questions asked :)
It starts very young with parents who don't take any responsibilty for their children's behaviour.
The other day I was standing in the local post office queue with a woman whose young daughter (aged 3 I'd say) was scootering all over the place and bashing into folk's legs. "Now darling, you know there's no scootering indoors" she cooed at the child, who ignored her mum and just carried on merrily scootering away....
The queue was long and her mother kept up this ineffectual twittering all the time, but basically let the wee girl carry on doing what she'd been told not to and did nothing about it...e.g. take the scooter away from her!:roll:
Later the same day I was forced onto the road by an older child (say 7 or 8) merrily scootering towards me while her mother, many yards behind, was too busy yakking into her mobile to notice what was happening. "Watch out!" I said as I fell off the kerb and in return got a sour and almost disbelieving look from the child, while her mother remained oblivious to any possible problem. [evil]
It may seem a trivial thing, but both these kids are being brought up to show no respect and consideration for anyone.
It starts very young with parents who don't take any responsibilty for their children's behaviour.
Not necessarily...
It starts very young with parents who don't take any responsibilty for their children's behaviour.
It may seem a trivial thing, but kids are being brought up to show no respect and consideration for anyone.
Totally agree with your point of view Angela
Not necessarily...
Perhaps I should have said 'it often starts'? I didn't mean that it does in 100% of cases.
But what other reasons would you suggest, Leanne? I don't think it's the children's fault.
Perhaps I should have said 'it often starts'? I didn't mean that it does in 100% of cases.
But what other reasons would you suggest, Leanne? I don't think it's the children's fault.
It is weak parenting and that doesn't have to come from young parents - I think saying that is quite disrespectful of the thousands of young parents out there who do bring their children up well. I know quite a few 'later in life' parents who spoil their kids rotten and let them get away with murder.
The parents of today were taught parenting skills by their parents - many of whom grew up in the permissive 60s. I blame the culture of the 60s for the downfall of society.
It is weak parenting and that doesn't have to come from young parents - I think saying that is quite disrespectful of the thousands of young parents out there who do bring their children up well. I know quite a few 'later in life' parents who spoil their kids rotten and let them get away with murder.
The parents of today were taught parenting skills by their parents - many of whom grew up in the permissive 60s. I blame the culture of the 60s for the downfall of society.
But I didn't say anything about young parents! :confused
In fact the two mothers I was referring to in my post were both 'older'.
I grew up in the 60s. Despite that my own upbringing (and that of my OH) was quite strict and we children were still seen but not heard. When we had children we were more relaxed than our parents had been, but nonetheless taught our three kids that there were boundaries to be observed and that it was important to be considerate of other people. This was before anybody even used the word 'parenting' as if it was a special skill -it was just what parents did.
This is exactly how my daughter and son in law are bringing up their wee girl because they feel (and both quite often say) that they had a positive upbringing themselves by parents who were involved in their children's lives. They don't simply ignore her and let her do whatever she fancies doing because it's too much bother to tear themselves away from the telly or the computer or whatever.
So I really don't think you can blame the 60s for everything! :roll:
But I didn't say anything about young parents! :confused
It starts very young with parents who don't take any responsibilty for their children's behaviour.
Seems you did?
Edit - 60s seemed to be the start of the downfall of society - people showed more respect prior to this decade. Some still had moral standards, just as some do now. But some didn't... And prior to the 60's society wouldn't have accepted it.
Seems you did?
Edit - 60s seemed to be the start of the downfall of society - people showed more respect prior to this decade. Some still had moral standards, just as some do now. But some didn't... And prior to the 60's society wouldn't have accepted it.
No, Leanne I didn't. I meant that it starts when the children are very young.
It would have made no sense at all to say 'it starts very young' if I was referring to the parents, would it? :confused
I would never suggest that young parents can't be just as good, if not better than older ones. Much more energy for a start in my experience. I was a parent for the first time at 22, which is hardly ancient! ;)
highland red
15-Mar-10, 13:47
I totally agree with almost eveything that's been said so far, but I can't help think that the influences from The USA play a big part in it. I really don't understand this obsession with everything American (and my Grandmother was American).
The daily influence of Macho, violence, TV programmes, gang culture and even the spoken word in the media etc. is enough to drive me mad.
The other thing that I think has become commonplace is that a lot of parents spend very little time with their children: they are in a lot of cases "out of sight out of mind".........that is until some unfortunate person has a run - in with these kids and they go to their parents telling them that someone has had a go at them.
What invariably happens is that the very same parents that don't want to know (or care) where the kids are and what they are up to, go searching for the adult that has had a go at these kids: and the times I've heard, "what are you doing to MY kids"? MY KIDS??? they weren't THEIR kids when they were up to mischief, but they are now.
Yes they're suddenly THEIR kids now and the same parents will take the word of the kids and leap to defend them at all costs.
My kids NEVER came to us to tell tales about who said what to them. WHY?....because they knew that if they were misbehaving at someone else's expense and got told off in the process, they were more than likely going to cop it from us for misbehaving and having no respect in the first place, and as such would be punished by us - The Parents.
As far as I'm concerned when things go pear-shaped you still cannot defend the indefensible.
Some parents are just not up to the job.
Feel better now after that rant.:roll:
No, Leanne I didn't. I meant that it starts when the children are very young.
It was a direct quote - that was exactly what you said. You might not have meant it but that was what you put. Maybe edit the post to say what you actually meant? The post can be misinterpreted at the very least...
No child is born naughty(i do hate the word bad so refuse to use it ever!), they are made that way. Children learn from example and look up to adults to guide them and show them how to behave. As an example of what most of us who have watched supernanny, when you shout or are aggressive to the way you handle your child testing they are just going to do it back at you. A firm, fair and consistent approach has been proved successful in managing all behaviour be it negative or postive. All basic stuff really and i do think that if you give in once to your child then it's once too many.
I do feel that when i was growing up i was tarred with the older sibling brush too much. I was made to feel responsible of my younger sister's actions and the mess she made. My parents never saw it and it took the oldest of my younger brothers to say something about the same feeling a while ago and for me to back him up for my mum to see it. I know how it feels and i will never do the same to my children. He/she who made the mess cleans it up i say.
I was appauled at a pregnant woman's atitude(sp) to how she'll deal with the sleepless nights and the hard parts of parenthood a couple of days ago. Bascially she's all for the showing of baby but when it comes to the hard parts she's said she'll give the baby to her mother to deal with. This truly sickened me. Maybe i'm just looking past the cute baby stage to toddler stage and further but to me you have to put the hard work in at the start if you want to reap the rewards of the hard work.
danc1ngwitch
15-Mar-10, 14:08
Children know right from wrong.
They learn to play parents because we as parents allow it.
We love, care and nurture our wee ones, we without knowing it teach them in many ways. ( good and bad ).
We need to take responsibility, All to often parents will have a chat about others infront of the wee ears, thinking they ain't listening. Before long they in return do the same.
They sometimes see lack of respect and therefore learn not to respect because they seem to catch onto the "who cares attitude".
Drink, smoking, you can go on and on and on and on and on.
Responsibility lays with us, bottom line.
It starts very young with parents who don't take any responsibilty for their children's behaviour.
Leanne, this is what I said. Direct quote!
That is not the same as saying "It starts with very young parents" which is what you seem to think I meant. :confused
I really don't understand why you're continuing to berate me for apparently thinking something which I don't think and have clearly stated that I don't think, or for being "disrespectful of...young parents" (your words).
What I posted seems perfectly clear to me -especially as I went on to give the example of a young child, 3 year old - and I have reiterated and elaborated on what I meant.
I'm not going to go back and edit my post because you've taken it upon yourself to decide that I should and to ignore my later posts.
This is going round in circles and doing the discussion no favours and that's my last word on the subject.
Ah I understand what you mean now. Maybe not the clearest worded post on the org but now you had explained it it makes sense.
Ah I understand what you mean now. Maybe not the clearest worded post on the org but now you had explained it it makes sense.
It made complete sense from the start, Leanne; you were simply wrong.
Ah I understand what you mean now. Maybe not the clearest worded post on the org but now you had explained it it makes sense.
I would say your understanding of what Angela posted, was not the clearest, I understood what she meant, maybe that is because I am one of those parents you have demonised,as both my sons were born and brought up in the 60's, and both were taught respect, good manners, and to be polite. And both turned out to be respectable citizens, and have never been out of work, don't take drugs, and their children respect their Grandparents also, I would therefore say a job well done by a parent of the 60's
Even "good" parents can have off days....
With their kids pushing the boundaries....even young children like my girls try to push the boundaries to see how far they can get before I snap or they end up in their rooms/on the stairs/back in the car...though I stopped that one when I worked out that Lauren was deliberately being bad to get out the shops!
But as a parent you have to pick your fights wisely and let some stuff slide sometimes...
If you had a teenager who sneaked in an hour late drunk, there would be little point shouting and yelling there and then....you wait until the morning,when they are sober (and hopefully they have a sore head)!
Little kids in queues are a difficult senario... messing about but happy... or told off and in total meltdown... as a parent no matter what you do you are in the wrong .... dirty looks all round!
Babies are born into this world with complete innocence. I'm afraid parents must accept full responsibility for how they turn out. In an ideal world parents should have to prove their competence before being allowed to procreate.
Babies are born into this world with complete innocence. I'm afraid parents must accept full responsibility for how they turn out. In an ideal world parents should have to prove their competence before being allowed to procreate.
Don't be ridiculous.
Don't be ridiculous.
What do you mean by ridiculous? Specify.
Aaldtimer
16-Mar-10, 04:06
In an ideal world parents should have to prove their competence before being allowed to procreate.
How can anyone prove their competence as a parent, without first of all, being one?:confused
Your logic is somewhat flawed!
How can anyone prove their competence as a parent, without first of all, being one?:confused
Your logic is somewhat flawed!
I agree, there are a couple of know it all non parents who are very good at pointing out parents errors and being child experts. Its not as easy and black and white as it looks. I have children and each one was different , but so far they have turned out well.:)
Yep and threats don't work! My young cousins were coming riding with me for the first time and they 'don't do' seatbelts. They usually pretty much do as I ask but on this day they were adamant they weren't wearing a seatbelt. I warned them that if they didn't put them on they weren't coming and they ummed and ahhed. I told them to get out of the car and riding was cancelled. They then started crying and put their belts on but I still held my ground and said they weren't going as they had their warning and still refused. My aunty said "but they're wearing them now". But that wasn't the point. She still doesn't 'get it' - and still has problems with them... I knew that if I had given in at that point we would have had the debate every time - yes they would have given in eventually but it would have been a huge fuss every time. The next week I went to pick them up and they got in the car and belted up no questions asked :)
:confused I never said threaten them? I always follow through any punishment that I have told them they are getting. No poiunt it saying they will get a punishment and then not following it through,as stated mine was given a months grounding so I dont consider that just being a threat?x
Little kids in queues are a difficult senario... messing about but happy... or told off and in total meltdown... as a parent no matter what you do you are in the wrong .... dirty looks all round!
I agree Dadie, I've been there myself as a parent and as a granny and I don't like to hear kids constantly being told "no, don't do that!" if it's really something that doesn't matter.
I've received dirty looks but also sympathetic smiles from folk when a wee one's been having a tantrum. Personally I can't help giving a parent a smile when I can see they're struggling and doing their best, but it's just not a good day.
A queue of older people having their legs whacked over and over by a small child whose Mum may well have been having a bad day ...well, maybe she should have sorted out the scooter issue before, so that her wee girl knows it's not for inside a small shop area?
I wasn't having a great time either - I've a neurological condition that makes standing for any length of time really painful. I didn't give the Mum a dirty look, but while maybe she was hiding her embarrassment she certainly didn't look at all bothered or interested in what her wee girl was doing.
How can anyone prove their competence as a parent, without first of all, being one?:confused
Your logic is somewhat flawed!
I feel that there should be a positive approach to motherhood, not just a stab in the dark. As many people here say, you are not provided with a set of instructions or DVD when your baby is born. In primitive times you did not need a manual as families knew instinctively how to raise children. This world has become so disfunctional even all the so called experts cannot agree on the correct form of upbringing. So unless we can revive all these instincts and start again from scratch, then the future of the planet is in the balance - as far as the human race is concerned. That's where the "ideal world" comes in and that is so far from here. So in the meantime we will just have to work with what we have and keep our fingers crossed.
I would say your understanding of what Angela posted, was not the clearest, I understood what she meant, maybe that is because I am one of those parents you have demonised,as both my sons were born and brought up in the 60's, and both were taught respect, good manners, and to be polite. And both turned out to be respectable citizens, and have never been out of work, don't take drugs, and their children respect their Grandparents also, I would therefore say a job well done by a parent of the 60's
I go along with that one all the way golach.
I feel that there should be a positive approach to motherhood, not just a stab in the dark. As many people here say, you are not provided with a set of instructions or DVD when your baby is born. In primitive times you did not need a manual as families knew instinctively how to raise children. This world has become so disfunctional even all the so called experts cannot agree on the correct form of upbringing. So unless we can revive all these instincts and start again from scratch, then the future of the planet is in the balance - as far as the human race is concerned. That's where the "ideal world" comes in and that is so far from here. So in the meantime we will just have to work with what we have and keep our fingers crossed.
I do agree with you. I do not agree fully with your other comment about people being screened before procreating. People change when they have children. I am seeing this in my partner. Some change for the worse while others change for the better. My partner is in the latter. I already know that i'm to the job through the person i am at work (if you didn't know i work in a nursery that has children ranging from 3 months old to 10 years old attending) I fair, firm and consistent with children, I have a strong caring instinct that takes in any child in my care and makes me ensure they get the best care and their needs are met. I also am very chilled and relaxed about things when it comes to the kids. Once the try to step out of line though they are very quickly put back in place. The children at my work know that i am very patient, caring and quite chilled out but that when i say no i mean no. For this i think i get alot of respect from them. Out of my other siblings and step siblings i am the one that my younger brothers will listen to all the time and not try to make a fool of when our folks are out or away.
I think having realistic expectations of what having your own kids will be like is the best thing you can do to prepare yourself for parenthood. I'm prepared for everything my wee one throws at me and i know its hard work but its worth it. To think of only the nice bits and ignore the hard bits before and after having your baby is not the way to do it. You set yourself up to fail by doing that.
David Banks
16-Mar-10, 19:44
Is it just me or does this board at the moment seem to think that the root of all societies evils is the child?
K
You've had plenty of responses, so I'm wondering if it just me who wants to know:
- what board are you referring to?
- what evidence is there for massive blaming of children for everything that goes wrong?
[quote=highland red;675958]I totally agree with almost eveything that's been said so far, but I can't help think that the influences from The USA play a big part in it. I really don't understand this obsession with everything American (and my Grandmother was American).
The daily influence of Macho, violence, TV programmes, gang culture and even the spoken word in the media etc. is enough to drive me mad. END QUOTE........
I live 'near America', and yes they have their issues, but what about Coronation St, Eastenders etc., which I think on a Sat/ Sun get played back to back for approx 2 hours and some of the ''''dirt' on there doesn't exactly put chastity into the kids.....
The American mentality is notorious....but their Constitution, and the way they think is all about Guns...and the right to 'bear arms', so naturally the people play with guns...
At the Casper, Wyoming Post Office a man arrives in a pickup truck with 2 rifles and a shotgun in the back window, He exits the vehicle carrying a 6 shot revolver and about 45 bullets on his belt, over his jacket. And the Waitress in the restaurant carries a 2 shot derringer in her cowboy boot...All quite normal
It is only illegal for the man, if her hides it under his jacket.. The Yanks will always play cowboys and Indians....as we did in Caithness!
Just a thought.....
onecalledk
17-Mar-10, 10:52
You've had plenty of responses, so I'm wondering if it just me who wants to know:
- what board are you referring to?
- what evidence is there for massive blaming of children for everything that goes wrong?
This board in general, if you read the threads on the Bulger story and the "kids of today" postings you will read that generally the kids of today are to blame for societies ills.
I merely put across the notion that its not the children that are to blame nor often the parents in todays world. My mothers generation (I am 40) didnt have to fight against the internet or the tv as there was no internet and the tv had little influence on us kids.
Todays parents have a very difficult job to do as we dont only have to worry about the safety of our kids as generations before did but also deal with the influence of tv, internet etc.
The world today is spiralling out of control and we are desperately trying to hang on by our finger nails. The media is driving the forced adulthood onto our children.
A conversation I had with my younger sister proved my point at the weekend. She has a work colleague who has a 2 yr old girl. The little girl is dressed like a mini adult but her mother seems oblivious to what she is doing. Look at the outfits in shops for kids, look at the media influence, the content of "childrens" programmes, magazine etc . All of it with underlying adult themes........
Society is pushing our children down a path of destruction. The american influence is also a worry. We have a generation of children who use "american" phrases all the time.......
We need to take a long hard look at what we in this country do to our children. We tolerate them, perhaps we should nurture them .....
K
[quote=Vistravi;676569]I do agree with you. I do not agree fully with your other comment about people being screened before procreating.
To me there's a world of difference between screening and competence. Screening tends to be physical, whereas competence could be looked on as a mental process. Far too many parents have "issues" and are so "screwed up" in their own heads to be competent to take on the delicate, timeconsuming, mental and physical task of looking after a new baby. The improtance of close personal relationship with your own baby is lost, even to government, who insist all mothers should go to work and leave their babies in the care of strangers - a bonus if you have a husband or close family network. Not a luxury everyone has!
So back again to the "ideal" world. We will never be able to put in place all the factors needed to give us well rounded happy children as the norm. Congratulations to all the folks who do so against all the odds.
This is a sobering wee clip of an experiment in USA. This experiment has apparently been banned in this country as the effects are thought to be harmful. It send shivers down my spine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apzXGEbZht0&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
This board in general, if you read the threads on the Bulger story and the "kids of today" postings you will read that generally the kids of today are to blame for societies ills.
I merely put across the notion that its not the children that are to blame nor often the parents in todays world. My mothers generation (I am 40) didnt have to fight against the internet or the tv as there was no internet and the tv had little influence on us kids.
Todays parents have a very difficult job to do as we dont only have to worry about the safety of our kids as generations before did but also deal with the influence of tv, internet etc.
The world today is spiralling out of control and we are desperately trying to hang on by our finger nails. The media is driving the forced adulthood onto our children.
A conversation I had with my younger sister proved my point at the weekend. She has a work colleague who has a 2 yr old girl. The little girl is dressed like a mini adult but her mother seems oblivious to what she is doing. Look at the outfits in shops for kids, look at the media influence, the content of "childrens" programmes, magazine etc . All of it with underlying adult themes........
Society is pushing our children down a path of destruction. The american influence is also a worry. We have a generation of children who use "american" phrases all the time.......
We need to take a long hard look at what we in this country do to our children. We tolerate them, perhaps we should nurture them .....
K
I agree, nurturing them is what being a parent is about surely? Why have children if you don't want to spend time with them, listen to them, explain things to them, show interest in their interests, read them bedtime stories when they're wee and generally provide them with a loving and supportive framework for them to grow into responsible, confident, happy adults?
I agree too that it is harder to be a parent now, tho' it's never been an easy job. Life is lived at a faster pace, parents seem to have much less time outwith work, and there are lots of competing pressures on everybody.
I believe that our society's obsession with celebrity, fostered by the media, is a major factor. In some cases young children become a sort of desirable fashion accessory to be kitted out in on-trend clothes and shown off, but otherwise pretty much ignored. (Of course celebs usually have nannies to care for their kids.)
Kids are growing up much too quickly in many cases and clothes for young girls in particular often send out an inappropriately sexual message.
For a while in the 70s and 80s I believe that we were more involved with our children than ever before. It became the norm for fathers to be present at the birth of their children -previously unheard of! -and for Dads to become much more actively involved in the care of their children.
In the past 20 or so years society has continued to change at an even faster pace and sadly some children seem to be relegated to being pretty much ignored and left to watch TV and play computer games in their rooms, eating separate ready meals at different times of day.
On a more positive note all the children I come into contact with seem to be being brought up in quite a traditional family-centred way, by parents who are prepared to stick to their own values and pass them on to their kids.
It's not all doom and gloom and again perhaps it's the media fostering that impression that makes the situation seem worse than it is? There seems to be little interest in good news these days.
[quote=nightowl;676892][quote=Vistravi;676569]I do agree with you. I do not agree fully with your other comment about people being screened before procreating.
To me there's a world of difference between screening and competence. Screening tends to be physical, whereas competence could be looked on as a mental process.Far too many parents have "issues" and are so "screwed up" in their own heads to be competent to take on the delicate, timeconsuming, mental and physical task of looking after a new baby. The improtance of close personal relationship with your own baby is lost, even to government, who insist all mothers should go to work and leave their babies in the care of strangers - a bonus if you have a husband or close family network. Not a luxury everyone has!
So back again to the "ideal" world. We will never be able to put in place all the factors needed to give us well rounded happy children as the norm. Congratulations to all the folks who do so against all the odds.
This is a sobering wee clip of an experiment in USA. This experiment has apparently been banned in this country as the effects are thought to be harmful. It send shivers down my spine. End of quote.
Pray tell me where the Gov't Insists that all Parents should go to work & leave their children in the care of strangers?
And this small experiment gives you shivers???
And trust me the Majority of people are Not Screwed Up/ and the Majority of Childen are good. The authorities deal with a very small % of children..as one quote said....5% of the children 95% of the time....
You are right Sandyr1, the government does not insist that all mothers need to work. It just intends slashing the benefits of parents who do not look for work.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/advice/money/2009/07/08/cutting-benefits-of-single-parents-will-increase-number-of-kids-in-poverty-115875-21503859/
I did not say that all mothers were "screwed up" just that too many of them were.
I do find it worrying though, that sixty five schools in Scotland feel the need to have a resident police officer at a cost of £2,000,000 a year
http://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/1650051?UserKey=
In Canada & the United States, Police Officers are detailed to the inner City Schools, but at no cost to the education system and in other areas Police are given a number of schools to generally look after and pop in on occasion.
The main difference here is that they are fully armed..40 calibre Glock Semi Automatic, with 15 shells and two magazines, pepper, stun gun/tazer etc etc... It's just an accepted fact here, even in Canada that Police Carry guns... I feel it does make a difference, perhaps a deterrent and also a Public Relations effect.
The World has graduated to a whole new unknown. We don't have much of the Anti Social Behaviour. As I said most of the kids are good.
I think each and every child is brought up differently and each and every one has their own unique identity, thus what is good for one is perhaps not good for another. I hear what you say about people being messed up but even so, some go onto greatness..Look at Obama...his life was not easy...& your Prime minister...was it Major who used to give speeches on a soap box in Brixton, the roughest area in London..yes I worked there!
Of course we all have out own opinions but I have dealt with people for over 40 years and I find the vast majority are good...like you and me!!:D
onecalledk
18-Mar-10, 11:05
[quote=Vistravi;676569]I do agree with you. I do not agree fully with your other comment about people being screened before procreating.
To me there's a world of difference between screening and competence. Screening tends to be physical, whereas competence could be looked on as a mental process. Far too many parents have "issues" and are so "screwed up" in their own heads to be competent to take on the delicate, timeconsuming, mental and physical task of looking after a new baby. The improtance of close personal relationship with your own baby is lost, even to government, who insist all mothers should go to work and leave their babies in the care of strangers - a bonus if you have a husband or close family network. Not a luxury everyone has!
So back again to the "ideal" world. We will never be able to put in place all the factors needed to give us well rounded happy children as the norm. Congratulations to all the folks who do so against all the odds.
This is a sobering wee clip of an experiment in USA. This experiment has apparently been banned in this country as the effects are thought to be harmful. It send shivers down my spine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apzXGEbZht0&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
thank god it was banned in this country ! this is shocking in the extreme and there is no reason at all to have this experiment, this is not new stuff, scientists have known about the connection to socialisation for decades. its the very lack of responses or negative responses from parents between the ages of 0 and 2 yrs of age that harm childrens mental health.
Babies are manipulative by nature because they HAVE to be, they depend on their parents for everything in the first few years of life. For them to survive they need to be able to get their needs across as speech does not kick in til they are around 2yrs old.
It was a very difficult clip to watch and the stress on the mothers face was obvious, she didnt so much have a "no face" as a very stressed face. Baby didnt just pick up on the straight face, he picked up on his mothers stress......
K
danc1ngwitch
18-Mar-10, 15:02
Lets begin with honesty, some posts are just to :rolleyes:
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.